The end is nigh!

[RamesesII]

One question will the world really end, well of course it will.

One way or another the earth will finally breath its last breath and be destroyed or become entirely void of life, maybe not in our lifetime maybe not even before we have become advanced enough to seek out other viable planets to inhabit or maybe not even in the human races time but it is 100% certain that the earth will die.

My bets is that either the human race will become extinct from many conclusive reasons before we or our future relatives ever see the end of the world, but one day the sun being a star will explode and take the entire galaxy with it, actually that makes a good point what stage is the sun at now, if in the process of it's life when it become a red dwarf will the increases or decrease in size alter the planets orbit around it, or when it becomes supernova will the increased density pull us towards it or will we just be sucked into the black hole it leaves in its wake.

Your views? Do you think the human race will survive to see the end or will the end happened after our extinction?

[smurphy]

I believe that the human race is the embodiment of the phrase " survival of the fittest/strongest". Somehow whenever there has been major problems we have always been able to adapt and at his moment in time unless we are annihilated by a virus that mutates at incredible speeds we have plenty of time to figure out a way of handling whatever the universe throws at us.

The Earth is a different matter. It will be vaporised when the sun starts becoming a red giant roughly 5-6 billion years down the line. Plenty of time for us to master space travel and terraforming.

[Furore]

My guess is that eventually humans may prove almost as hard to kill as cockroaches if we're allowed to become technologically advanced enough. Though I also think we may very well prove to be the force that kills us in some way so long as it happens before a serious natural event.

[Dodie16]

I'm also on the view that the world when end because our sun will no longer be able to do it's job. It's a star, and it too has a life-cycle like all the other stars in the universe. Of course, we don't have to worry about it happening in our lifetime, but future generations (waaaaaay down the line) will be faced with this crisis, if humanity lasts that long.

I really don't want future generations of people to have to deal with a dying sun. I think that would be one of the worst things to have to deal with, since there would be nothing you could do about it. Well, unless there was another planet somewhere out in this great universe of ours that was capable of sustaining life, and they somehow are able to reach it. If that did happen, I'm pretty sure there would still be people that would be left behind. Kind of sad to think about really.

As for what I think will destroy humanity, I saw a documentary about it once. I think the first one was a super virus that was mutated to where it was near impossible to find a cure. I think the example was a mutated ebola virus. The scenario was that some scientist created it for use for germ-warfare, and it got into the wrong hands and was used to wipe out large numbers of people, but got out of control.

Another one I remember was that a big asteroid would hit the earth, and would corrupt the atmosphere so bad that it would be toxic to us and unable to support life. Just out of my curiosity, I looked up some statistics to see how likely that would be. Here's what I got:

And the chance of that happening is, from historical comparison, 0.001% or less.

Haha... Hopefully, that number stays that small.

Did I just get off-track with all that? Sometimes, I get rather chatty.

[RamesesII]

Haha... Hopefully, that number stays that small.

Did I just get off-track with all that? Sometimes, I get rather chatty.

Despite how small it is that's still a chance it could happen, I also agree it is obviously evident that we are killing ourselves, the rate at which we produce waste and refuse far out weighs the rate at which it degrades to the point that the landfills will start to poison the soils and therefore plants will find it harder to grow if grow at all which of course is our supply of oxygen.

Not only that but all the chemical and nuclear waste as an outrageous half life and where is that put yes once again into the ground and sea and as long as we have nuclear reactors and power plants or any sort of energy producing company we will keep producing it.

[Alpha]

The 'Earth' has already been destroyed several times, sort of. Elements higher up the periodic table than iron (26), such as gold (79), are formed in supernovas. Either a star in our region of the galaxy aged and developed into a supernova, and created these elements, and/or they were blasted across space to be coalesced into Earth as we know it.

So for certain it will happen again.

If you want to look at the human world, then it's probably going to come from excess, and environmental disregard. We rely on a stable environment. We are incredibly vulnerable to an unstable environment - divorced from nature as we are.

Then there's war (nuclear, resource, ideological), famine, disease, accidents (e.g. meteoric), etc. We sure do live in a happy place.

[chrono]

Though I also think we may very well prove to be the force that kills us in some way so long as it happens before a serious natural event.

This.


Before we could master peace we mastered destruction.

[Sinister]

I'm confused... You say "world" and then talk about the human race being annihilated and the planet Earth. The word world traditionally doesn't refer to the planet Earth, but the whole of human existence. If you mean the planet Earth. Then, of course, but it's destruction doesn't necessarily have to spell the destruction of the human race. (wow, that sounded...sci-fi)

Either way, both are practically doomed. We are even so fatalist as a race of creatures, that we have hundreds of eschatologies and are adding more every day. Personally, I think we know that we won't last forever. It's good that we don't have any delusions. Change has always been the natural norm for the universe, so there's no need to fake surprise.

As for the end...being nigh. I rather doubt it, however you use the term.

-Sin

[The Dark Crystal]

Well our sun isn't expected to die out for a couple of billion years. If we are still alive by then i am sure we would already have the technology to leave the earth in search for other earth sistanable planets, considering their is other suns 100 time greater in mass then our sun now.

If we live in the 'Goldilock zone" which means we are at the perfect distance from the sun to make earth inhabitable (Temperature wise for us) who says their isn't more possibilities of other planet to live on with a sun that is a hundred times bigger then ours in another galaxy. Yea i know ranting!

For the meteors, we do have advanced technology that can track most of them around us. I agree that still does not rule them out, but we have a hell of a bigger chance then the dinosaurs!

If another supernova even blows up a billions miles around us we will not survive plain and simple! ( if we are hit by the radiation )

As for a black hole, scientist believe their is one at every center of each galaxy, but i don't think that has been proven. If their is who knows it could be lying dormant until it needs more mass to feed off of. If thats true it is most likely we will not survive considering it will disrupte the gravitational pull of all the planets which all plays a vital part for the earth. (correct me if im wrong, but in a respectable manner please!)

For the natural disasters i would go with a super volcano. For one it would cover most of the atmosphere with dust and chemical that will block out the sun, and thus changing the earths whole climate. (you can figure out the effects their)

Then there's war (nuclear, resource, ideological), famine, disease, accidents, etc. We sure do live in a happy place.

A happy one indeed!

Hope you enjoyed, and i am sure their are plenty of more ways that we can be wiped out!

[loaf]

Tomorrow a nuclear warfare can be upon us.

If we want peace then the entire human race will have to be wiped out. Only way of world peace.

I really don't care for all this end of the world junk. If it happens it happens.

My theory on black holes, if there truly is one in the center of galaxies the my theory is they are just transports to other black holes throughout the universe.

[OnOneRyder]

One question will the world really end, well of course it will.

One way or another the earth will finally breath its last breath and be destroyed or become entirely void of life, maybe not in our lifetime maybe not even before we have become advanced enough to seek out other viable planets to inhabit or maybe not even in the human races time but it is 100% certain that the earth will die.

My bets is that either the human race will become extinct from many conclusive reasons before we or our future relatives ever see the end of the world, but one day the sun being a star will explode and take the entire galaxy with it, actually that makes a good point what stage is the sun at now, if in the process of it's life when it become a red dwarf will the increases or decrease in size alter the planets orbit around it, or when it becomes supernova will the increased density pull us towards it or will we just be sucked into the black hole it leaves in its wake.

Your views? Do you think the human race will survive to see the end or will the end happened after our extinction?

Hate to nitpick, but some of your science is just...wrong. First off supernova's, they don't pack the punch to destroy an entire galaxy...in fact nothing does. You have instances where one galaxy impacts another and this results in a much bigger more disorganized galaxy.

The fate of our sun isn't nearly as violent as you've stated. It and our solar system are more than likely the product of past cosmic events like a supernova and the sun doesn't have the mass to end as a supernova. It's going to expand to a cool red giant and eventually become a white dwarf. I BELIEVE this will include a nebula but my knowledge may be off on that one. I do however know for certain the death of our star will not result in a black hole.

Do I think we'll be around to experience this? Absolutely not. Like other people have stated our survival relies heavily on the stability of nature and there is just too much celestial activity with odds against us that will wipe us out. There are stars close enough to us which can and WILL go supernova before the death of our own sun and this will be something we simply cannot survive through, nothing will.

As for a black hole, scientist believe their is one at every center of each galaxy, but i don't think that has been proven. If their is who knows it could be lying dormant until it needs more mass to feed off of. If thats true it is most likely we will not survive considering it will disrupte the gravitational pull of all the planets which all plays a vital part for the earth. (correct me if im wrong, but in a respectable manner please!)

Supermassive black hole's like the one's found at the center of most galaxies are not proven to be in all galaxies, correct. However stellar blackholes are rather common. Black hole's are one of those things in the universe that we still know very little about. Their affects on the structure of galaxies is not completely known but at great distance they don't really affect our solar system. Gravity is an extremely weak force, billions of times weaker than say electro magnetism. Also yes, the positions of other planets play greatly into the fact that life can exist on earth. The massive gravity of a planet like Jupiter shields us from meteor and comet impacts that could be deadly.

[RamesesII]

Hate to nitpick, but some of your science is just...wrong. First off supernova's, they don't pack the punch to destroy an entire galaxy...in fact nothing does. You have instances where one galaxy impacts another and this results in a much bigger more disorganized galaxy.

The fate of our sun isn't nearly as violent as you've stated. It and our solar system are more than likely the product of past cosmic events like a supernova and the sun doesn't have the mass to end as a supernova. It's going to expand to a cool red giant and eventually become a white dwarf. I BELIEVE this will include a nebula but my knowledge may be off on that one. I do however know for certain the death of our star will not result in a black hole.

Nevertheless whatever end the sun comes to either it goes supernova or whit dwarf it will still have the same effect on the surrounding solar system, the whole topic is about the certainty of our planets death and whether or not our species will be around to see it.

Well of course if you are predicting that the sun doesn't go supernova then of course there is no chance of it creating a black hole

Do I think we'll be around to experience this? Absolutely not. Like other people have stated our survival relies heavily on the stability of nature and there is just too much celestial activity with odds against us that will wipe us out. There are stars close enough to us which can and WILL go supernova before the death of our own sun and this will be something we simply cannot survive through, nothing will.

Well like I stated without a sun there will be no nature no photosynthesis therefore no oxygen, so unless we can create synthetic oxygen then hypothetically we wouldn't survive.

[OnOneRyder]

Well like I stated without a sun there will be no nature no photosynthesis therefore no oxygen, so unless we can create synthetic oxygen then hypothetically we wouldn't survive.

The sun dissapearing does not = no more oxygen. Oxygen just happens to be a by-product of photosynthesis, I assure you it will exist here and elsewhere in the universe as it's rather plentiful. Life however will die off long before this stage. Ecosystems which we rely on for survival are going to be shattered by extreme temperature changes as the sun changes, technology simply will not overcome the difficulties presented by basically a dead planet.

[The Dark Crystal]

The sun dissapearing does not = no more oxygen. Oxygen just happens to be a by-product of photosynthesis, I assure you it will exist here and elsewhere in the universe as it's rather plentiful. Life however will die off long before this stage. Ecosystems which we rely on for survival are going to be shattered by extreme temperature changes as the sun changes, technology simply will not overcome the difficulties presented by basically a dead planet.

Without the sun, photosynthesis will not occur! so i am sorry, but you are wrong! I am not saying their will not be oxygen after the sun is gone, but it will no longer be produced, thus we will RUN OUT! Like i said the sun is not going to die out for another 2 billion years so i think by that time we will be able to create our own form of energy for plants so yes technology can save us(look at what we have done the past 200 years). If you have any other comment please read everything before you type anything else, and possible do some research!

[OnOneRyder]

Without the sun, photosynthesis will not occur! so i am sorry, but you are wrong! I am not saying their will not be oxygen after the sun is gone, but it will no longer be produced, thus we will RUN OUT! Like i said the sun is not going to die out for another 2 billion years so i think by that time we will be able to create our own form of energy for plants so yes technology can save us(look at what we have done the past 200 years). If you have any other comment please read everything before you type anything else, and possible do some research!

You're confused, I never claimed that oxygen would still be produced. I simply stated it would still exist. Whether or not it would be a level high enough to maintain life is irrelavent as the effects the dying sun will have on life will wipe out plant and animal life far sooner than our sun stops producing light. When it starts running out of hydrogen it will expand from it's current state into a red giant many times it's current diameter. The amount of energy it will be giving off will turn the earth into an inferno, anything living on the surface will be incinerated. Of course the existence of oxygen and an atmosphere at all assumes the solar winds produced by the new giant will not wipe out our atmosphere all together.

As for your "research", the sun has been estimated to have enough fuel to continue burning for another 5 billion years or so, and will continue to radiate energy for an unknown amount of time after that in the form of a white dwarf.

[Che]

Please don't turn this into a butthurt "i'm more right than you are" contest, you two. This happens in just about every thread in ID eventually. It doesn't matter who's right or wrong, it's a discussion. No problem with correcting people, but it's annoying having to hear people frantically defend themselves and attack others to take the focus off themselves.

That being said, I think we'll kill ourselves well before any major natural disaster does.

The Pentagon’s mad science arm may have come up with its most radical project yet. Darpa is looking to re-write the laws of evolution to the military’s advantage, creating “synthetic organisms” that can live forever — or can be killed with the flick of a molecular switch.

As part of its budget for the next year, Darpa is investing $6 million into a project called BioDesign, with the goal of eliminating “the randomness of natural evolutionary advancement.” The plan would assemble the latest bio-tech knowledge to come up with living, breathing creatures that are genetically engineered to “produce the intended biological effect.” Darpa wants the organisms to be fortified with molecules that bolster cell resistance to death, so that the lab-monsters can “ultimately be programmed to live indefinitely.”

Of course, Darpa’s got to prevent the super-species from being swayed to do enemy work — so they’ll encode loyalty right into DNA, by developing genetically programmed locks to create “tamper proof” cells. Plus, the synthetic organism will be traceable, using some kind of DNA manipulation, “similar to a serial number on a handgun.” And if that doesn’t work, don’t worry. In case Darpa’s plan somehow goes horribly awry, they’re also tossing in a last-resort, genetically-coded kill switch:



Read More Pentagon Looks to Breed Immortal ‘Synthetic Organisms,’ Molecular Kill-Switch Included | Danger Room | Wired.com

[The Dark Crystal]

The Pentagon’s mad science arm may have come up with its most radical project yet. Darpa is looking to re-write the laws of evolution to the military’s advantage, creating “synthetic organisms” that can live forever — or can be killed with the flick of a molecular switch.

As part of its budget for the next year, Darpa is investing $6 million into a project called BioDesign, with the goal of eliminating “the randomness of natural evolutionary advancement.” The plan would assemble the latest bio-tech knowledge to come up with living, breathing creatures that are genetically engineered to “produce the intended biological effect.” Darpa wants the organisms to be fortified with molecules that bolster cell resistance to death, so that the lab-monsters can “ultimately be programmed to live indefinitely.”

Of course, Darpa’s got to prevent the super-species from being swayed to do enemy work — so they’ll encode loyalty right into DNA, by developing genetically programmed locks to create “tamper proof” cells. Plus, the synthetic organism will be traceable, using some kind of DNA manipulation, “similar to a serial number on a handgun.” And if that doesn’t work, don’t worry. In case Darpa’s plan somehow goes horribly awry, they’re also tossing in a last-resort, genetically-coded kill switch:

Wow thats exsacually what we need! NOT!!!

You're confused, I never claimed that oxygen would still be produced. I simply stated it would still exist. Whether or not it would be a level high enough to maintain life is irrelavent as the effects the dying sun will have on life will wipe out plant and animal life far sooner than our sun stops producing light. When it starts running out of hydrogen it will expand from it's current state into a red giant many times it's current diameter. The amount of energy it will be giving off will turn the earth into an inferno, anything living on the surface will be incinerated. Of course the existence of oxygen and an atmosphere at all assumes the solar winds produced by the new giant will not wipe out our atmosphere all together.

Yes i guess i did, and i apologize for that! I still believe that if we are still around after that 2 or 5 billion years we will be long gone from this planet. Or for the future generations sake they will be!

[Alpha]

Wouldn't it just be a shit load easier if we stopped fighting wars?

All this military technology... one day we will get ahead of ourselves, and be left with M.A.D. - mutually-assured destruction.

[Howling Wind]

Man dominates man to his own injury. The world will end. I don't know how. And I don't believe it will end in 2012 because the Bible says man can't predict when the world will end. If it is something to do with the sun it sounds possible. Its the opposite of a flood and God promised he would never clear the earth with water again. But I have a feeling war will break out. And man will kill himself off. Or at least thin out the earth before God or a natural disaster does. I have talked to my parents a lot about this. I even typed this up and showed it to them today and asked them if it was a good answer. So this is my answer and I really don't know when it will end or how advanced tech stuff will be. Who knows really? I don't think I will live long enough to know. But the world could end today or tomorrow or a billion years from now. But I guess how is the real question.

[midgetbob]

Hrmmm... I haven't read up on it in awhile (mostly the if it's happening, it's happening soon, so what's it matter if i'm well informed still or not), but I thought a read a few studies on teh 2012 Mayan/Aztec Calendar prediction to be nothing more then them hitting a point with the metric system where starting over would seem logical.

If this isn't the case, I think something besides a catastrophic ending to the world is actually neigh.

Most ancient civilizations have mention of either a bearded man in a White Robe came and helped teach them animal husbandry / domestication, agricultural advancements, and construction along with code of laws and some sort of caste system. Some even have specific accountings of chariots in the sky and men in (space)suits.

This can be "verified" by certain civilizations emerging at the same time, and linking of architectural motiffs in their designs, along with their mythology.

So, maybe the calendar was basically a way for them to know when the "teachers" would be returning?

1,000 years is a long time for a civilization to advance and mature. 10,000 is even longer. Would be interesting to see if some intelligent life returns to earth, arriving at locations like Peru, Mexico (Belieze), Egypt, India, Laos etc... some of the 2nd and 3rd World Countries that these similar connectors have arisen.

[Alpha]

Most ancient civilizations have mention of either a bearded man in a White Robe came and helped teach them animal husbandry / domestication, agricultural advancements, and construction along with code of laws and some sort of caste system. Some even have specific accountings of chariots in the sky and men in (space)suits.

This can be "verified" by certain civilizations emerging at the same time, and linking of architectural motiffs in their designs, along with their mythology.

So, maybe the calendar was basically a way for them to know when the "teachers" would be returning?

1,000 years is a long time for a civilization to advance and mature. 10,000 is even longer. Would be interesting to see if some intelligent life returns to earth, arriving at locations like Peru, Mexico (Belieze), Egypt, India, Laos etc... some of the 2nd and 3rd World Countries that these similar connectors have arisen.

That is positively the most ridiculous thing I have ever read.

Any kind of knowledge of the history of agriculture would point this out. So that's what I'll do. Here's a rudimentary outline of the mother flippin' history of civilisation.

In the Paleolithic ('paleo' = 'old'; 'lithic' = 'stone'; therefore, the paleolithic is the 'old stone age') stage of human development, we were pre-agricultural nomads, although there may have been a few permanent coastal settlements. We lived in small groups (<50) so we could migrate frequently. We ate leaves, nuts, berries, roots, and hunted animals and other humans. We had no domesticated animals. To survive, we needed intimate knowledge of of plant and animal resources, as well as of local geography. Much of this knowledge was reflected in culture, such as traditional songs. It's possible remnants of this still survives today, and the practice itself certainly continues. We were a low-impact 'civilisation'.

As the Neolithic dawned, we began to become agricultural. By about 12,000 years ago, human populations had spread into most habitable regions. Agriculture developed for the first time ~10,000 years ago (the end of the Pleistocene, or the Holocene in geological time, which is the present epoch). The development of agriculture coincided with the emergence of the temperate climate associated with this period.

[By the way, the lower-end projections for the concentration of CO2 in the atmosphere at 2100 is 500m parts per million (PPM). This has never existed in the past million years, and certainly not while we humans have used agriculture to sustain our way of life. Can our changes to the environment sustain human population?]

Anyway, we worked out that certain plants and animals could be manipulated, so we wouldn't have to travel around so damn much. Planting crops and simple forms of herding animals led to food surpluses, which had a multitude of impacts. These include:

• Complex divisions of labour (incl. non-productive occupations and capitalists).
• Complex society and political organisation.
• Large armies (empire expansion).
• More control of natural resources.
• Population growth and demographic change.

What this all leads to is the dawn of civilisation.

[By the way, ENERGY is fundamental to every system - even human ones. Agriculturalists harnessed the energy of domesticated animals, wind, and water. Pre-agriculturalist society was driven by human physical work. Our modern society is driven by fossil fuels! 'Cos it's smart to balance our entire civilisation on something that will run out and shit.]

The earliest evidence for agriculture is in the so-called 'Fertile Crescent', which consisted of the temperate regions of the Nile Valley, Western Asia, the Zagros Mountains (in Iran), Anatolia (Turkey), northern Syria, and the Jordan River Valley. Empires were able to develop, because of agriculture. Look at the Egyptian, Assyrian, Greek, Roman, Byzantine, Holy Roman, Xia, Shang, Zhou, and Qin empires (the last four are Chinese, if you didn't know. Turns out they barely teach geography in schools these days.)

As knowledge 'travelled' (most likely with merchants and explorers), agriculture spread from the Fertile Crescent in the Middle East, into Europe. Yes, Western Civilsation, you owe your existence to the Arabs. Now stop stealing the oil.

And then time progressed and knowledge traveled further. We had the Renaissance of the 1500s, the Reformation of the 1600s, European revolutions of the 1700s, Industrial revolutions of the 1800s, and then colonialism, and then post-colonialism, and now globalism. Note that this is the Western story. Most of the world didn't get it so sweet. But this is how you're taught it in school, right?

Basically, it's not about some giant, kick-ass flood sent by God to wipe out humanity (I thought He preached love and forgiveness anyway...), and it's certainly not about some aliens with white beards. It's all logical and chronological. Agriculture came naturally, and it led to a series of changes that have culminated in now.

What's interesting is that in 2009, the ratio of rural to urban people tipped, for the first time ever. There are now, officially, more people living in cities than in rural spaces. How this pans out with regards to meeting human needs remains to be seen. We're living in very exciting times!

[midgetbob]

That is positively the most ridiculous thing I have ever read.

Oh you're ****ing lucky I accidently hit back and lost my first post.... I'll try redoing it to smash on your face again.

Firstly, through many of the first civilizations, there is a myth or legend of someone coming through and teaching humans the beginnings of civilization, agriculture and animal husbandry. Simply look up the myths and legends of these civilizations. Even check the mythology surrounding them. Some of the civs even have markings of visitors in their writings and art. It's simply fact that something came according to them. Is it a "God" sent figure or an alien? Who knows. I certainly don't. Nor do you.

Secondly, since I don't believe the world is going to end in 2012, I threw out what some experts believe. Now, will aliens really pop down in December of 2012? Probably not, but that's not going to stop me from putting down something humorous like this as a possibility if others are going to put down that God will destroy the earth etc.

Third, holy high horse and self importance. I'm glad you passed your high school history and geography class... */golfclap* we're really impressed... REALLY. Wait, let me put this just incase you missed the sarcasm.

Now lets move onto your empires list... as everything before this is copy and paste for the most part, and mostly true. You did something right!

The Assyrians are the oldest in the list you have there, however there are cities in India (the sunken city for example) that are guessed to be at the latest 7500 BC and as early as 8-10000 BC (some even speculate this is a conservative guess). Geologically supported fact that vast parts of the India coastline being washed away, and civilizatinos disappearing from it. There is also evidence with satallite photo support of an ancient man-made bridge spanning the India / Sri Lanka divide.

Your use of Roman and Byzantine empires is ludacris (do you see what I did there? i used a pop culture refrence instead of the actual word: ludicrous), especially since the latter was simply the renaming of the Eastern Roman Empire in 330 AD. The rise of the Roman empire is far to "new" to be considered. The Byzantines is even worse. Civilizations were in the areas long before these empires emerged (or were renamed ), making that arguement moot.

The HRE (Holy Roman Empire) was a conglomerate of small city states and federations. The emperor was Elected and was formed around 950-960 AD. G'luck with that arguement as well.

As for your Chinese Dynasties (not empires... they called it a Dynasty), I'm really glad you could pull out some names from a hat. Xia was the oldest. The Qin was even in AD and roughly the same time as the Roman Empire. Once again, hardly the dawning of anything but moot arguements.

Some that you have left out or at least areas you've left out: India, Ethiopian Highlands, South Africa and the fertile West African hot bed of activity, Caral Supe (3000-2500 BC Peru), and a recent (2005) discovery of a temple series in Germany / Slovakia / Austria that predates the Pyramids (4500-4800 BC - Whoops! There goes your Western Europeans owe everything to everyone else theory... and you were really on a roll there!). I'll pretty much leave this alone at this point. You were doing so well at first....

The knowledge didn't exactly travel either. Many areas came up with these new theories and technologies at the same time. Which gives credence to the outside help theory some experts believe happened. good try though! I was rooting for you and your "The Arabs Taught Us Everything" attempts.

Your timeline also is a little askew for the arguements you're presenting. They helped the expansion of the dawning of civilization how? I could help you out with it a bit, but at this point, what IS the point? You've taken your notes from class and threw it down as fact. Read a book (it hurts when people assume, doesn't it?)

Now... on a fun side note. You said agriculture was the reasoning behind the emergence of empries. I have a pretty good 19 page essay I could try finding that I wrote on how all empires were based of the strategic assertion and control over cheese production. Any arguement can be validated if you twist the facts to the right light.

And again... while I do find the fact that ancient civilizations have a myth or legend linking them, and many experts find it strange that civilizations so far flung from each other will come up with so similar architectural designs, I don't think aliens will be landing. Though I think it's just a valid assumption of world ending dates as anything else listed.

So next time you want to assume the intelligence of a forum community (example of you're "These last ones are in China" etc etc etc ), be sure you got a lot of facts straight. Granted, some things you threw out were true... but overall... lets get some dr evil in on it....



Realize when a post is humorous, and realize when you're just trying to inflate your ePeen. Shouldn't you be arguing in the Obama time thread?

[Meier Link]

I am going to step in and say this once. If you can't be civil when having a debate, GTF out of ID. There is no reason for flaming and flamebaiting other members for their opinions on things or trying to illustrate a point.

Now lets play nice, keep things on the intelectual side and move this thread along. If I come in here and see some of the rules violations I have seen in the last few posts I will start handing out official warnings. Some of you can't afford another warning in ID.

If you haven't caught the hint yet, 2 warnings in ID = banned from ID.

[Alpha]

If you haven't caught the hint yet, 2 warnings in ID = banned from ID.

And so I won't be responding to midgetbob aside from saying that civilisation could only have started with agriculture. All forms of cities rely on permanent rural spaces. That's why my empires listed were not all ancient. Modern cities and ancient cities have the same requirements.

Also, congratulations of having a good geographical knowledge. If I came across as arrogant, it's because I'm a geography major, and I'm pretty passionate about it. There is much misconception about geography. Your knowledge is terrific, but I find this 'outside influence' notion completely absurd. I'll leave it at that.

[midgetbob]

I concur that the outside knowledge seems far fetched to me as well... but find it interesting that they all were able to come up with the same legends, ideas etc etc etc.

[Zephyr Leonhart]

I feel we will be gone long before this planet will. Scientifically the earth proves to be much older and sturdier than us, to the earth our existance has been a blink, Nothing more nothing less. Its like this save the earth crap, pick up plastic bags, yeah, the earth survive hurricane, earthquakes, volcanoes, solar rays, and a platic bag is gonna end it all...we are nothing.

[Heartless Angel]

As for the supernova thing, not our sun. Too small. It'll turn into a red giant, which should mean it will grow until it's about at Jupiter's orbit. So, Earth is definately ****ed there. Though, I don't know if we'll still be here when that happens, our sun is nowhere near the end of its life cycle. There are tons of ways humans could be destroyed; just to name a few...

• Gamma ray burst, we'd all pretty much be microwaved alive. Sucks to be us.
• Super virus, whether it's something some dumbass made as a bioweapon, or just something that mutates beyond treatment, a virus with no cure could easily wipe humanity out.
• Human stupidity, Why wait for nature when we have nukes?! FIRE!!!
• Mass Coronal Ejection; they disrupt the earth's magnetic field. Last time this happened, it wasn't too big a deal, a few places caught fire due to electrical disturbances, but there wasn't much electricity being used then, if it happened now, we could see a few cities burst into flame. That probably wouldn't END us, but it could certainly speed up the process.
• Supervolcanic activity; if we had a major eruption from like, Yellowstone or something, pretty much the entire U.S. would be toast, but the rest of the world would have to deal with the aftermath, like tons of ash being spewed into the atmosphere, blocking out the sun and such. Not to mention the possibility of volcanic chain reactions casuing other volcanoes to blow. All around, not a good thing. Might not end humanity, but it'll certainly get a nice start on it.
• Meteors, asteroids, and other such unfriendly celestial bodies. Boom. Simple, to the point. I like it.
• Human stupidity. Yes, I'm aware I said this one twice. But if I were a betting man, I'd say when humanity comes to an end, it'll be our fault.