People who light themselves on fire are really hot.

[Clint]

Fire's hot, so yeah, people who light themselves on fire would be really hot.

Also Bush did 9/11.

[Taco-Calamitous]

Can jet fuel burn through steel beams, tho?

[Clint]

No, but thermite can.

[Pete]

Or the fireproofing on the beams was in the middle of being removed and replaced, and/or was severely deficient in a number of spots.

Fireproofing is a cementitious spray that gets applied to structural steel for fire protection. It's largely an inflammable coating, but also serves to keep steel cooler in conjunction with sprinkler systems. In a normal fire, the sprinklers will wet the fireproofing, making it harder for the flames to heat the steel, which causes elongation and ultimately failure.

Bond coefficients were found to be weaker than the minimum requirements. Granted, a plane smashing into structural steel will most likely knock fireproofing off of steel, rendering the system useless, but if the fireproofing applied can't stick to the steel it's worthless.

Fireproofing was also found to be deficient at beam to core connections. The core of the building was where all stairs and elevators were. Beams supporting the floors were connected to the core with steel angles. The fireproofing was found to be insufficient in these areas, meaning that it probably wasn't thick enough, as per building codes and manufacturer's specs. It probably failed well before it was intended to. Then again, nobody had planned on planes flying in and fucking up several floors at once.

True story, I'm in construction and deal with fireproofing on a pretty regular basis. Whenever a contractor tells me not to worry about the fireproofing, I bring up the twin towers.

Other true story. I watched them fall from my history classroom window in high school. That sucked.

[Clint]

So you're saying the people who constructed the Twin Towers are worse than al Qaeda.

Also, and this is a bit off topic, but Greg has a micropenis, and he hid it from his wife for nine years.

[Pete]

Maybe the fireproofers were, or the ownership/ development partners, who, like all owners want the project to be done before the deadline and under budget. I'm not saying the fireproofing was THE cause that the towers fell, but it definitely didn't help things. Most buildings of that time, or really any time aren't built to withstand an impact of that kind. To be honest, I'm actually incredibly curious to see what the outcome would have been if the towers were built entirely out of high strength concrete. Maybe the buildings would have toppled at the point of impact into the streets, or the planes would have carried momentum and debris for a far larger path. Really makes you think, especially if you're in construction/ engineering.

Also, I don't know how I feel about the micropenis dude. If I was his wife I would be kinda pissed. This is also why you should test drive the car before you buy it.

[Master Garland]

Thanks for all that informative construction information Pete! It's always nice to learn something new. my brother was in construction and was just one semester from getting his contractors license if I remember correctly. I worked with him on many jobs 'under the table' and learnt some things along the way. Ever since then I now find construction and architecture really interesting. IMHO if something is going to be built it needs to be done by the book and straight by the set codes and standards.. cutting the project short to save money is wrong. I mean lives and general safety of the people taking residence or working in said place is at stake.

[Pete]

I couldn't agree with you more. I work with too many people who want to get things done yesterday. It's incredibly frustrating when they obviously want to cut corners or ask me to help them out in doing so. I always decline because in my line of work, I'm looking out for ownership. I don't really care what the contractors excuses are, because at the end of the day my responsibility is to the people who ultimately own the finished product.

Where is your brother located? I wasn't aware that college was a requirement for a contractors license.

[Master Garland]

Man you are a very honorable responsible person Pete. Too bad that's a quality lacking in many people.

Well it was a long time ago and I forgot details. So I may be mistaken on why he was in a rush to complete his degree at college. He's no longer interested in construction and instead is a lead line cook. However, this was in California in '07 and '08.

[Clint]

I work for NASA.

[Rowan]

I work for NASA.

I work fo NASAL.
its like NASA, just with more boogers.

[Clint]

That snot real, man.

[Rowan]

That snot real, man.

its as real as F.E.C.A.L

I shit you not.

[Yoko]

Pretty sure no one planned for a plane to hit the twin towers during the construction process.

No one expected the Spanish Inquisition.

[Pete]

Fun fact (not fun at all), they actually did!

However, the tests were conducted in 1964 with a Boeing 707, which was considered to be the largest commercial plane at the time. Further research is really a crazy rabbit hole of finger pointing and conspiracy theories.

[Yoko]

Actually, I am leaning towards believing that. As I work at an airport, we are always looking at the Obstacle Limitation Surface around it. Being that it was within the radius of a few airports, it would have been taken into consideration. Anything that is beyond a certain height needs special permissions and permits in order for the FAA to file the appropriate NOTAMs.

That being said, pilots know to check NOTAMs before they fly. Pretty sure those people weren't pilots. Not an inside job.

[Pete]

Well the original theory behind the testing was that it could be a plane low on fuel searching for an airport in extreme low visibility.

There are an insane amount of aspects to consider as to why the towers fell. My heart wants to tell me that there's no way that this could have been an inside job, but my brain and strange coincidences (like the property owner managing to get ridiculous terrorism insurance coverage with an immediate payout, or him having construction plans for a brand new tower 7 as of April 2000) tell me otherwise.

[Yoko]

Aha, that I didn't know, I'm just throwing around baseless opinion because I'm not interested in doing the research on this topic.

It's so nice talking to people though! I feel like we havent spoken in years!

[Clint]

The main reason the towers fell is because they were rigged to detonate, though. I also don't believe tornadoes are real.

[Pete]

Tower 7 may have been. There's video evidence of the property owner telling somebody to "pull it".

I don't believe the two towers fell because of detonation though. I believe that the weakening of several floors, plus fires weakened the steel angles connecting the floor joists to the steel beams. It's entirely likely that the pops that look like controlled demolition are actually the concrete, fireproofing and other materials attached to the area separating from the other steel beams and columns. It's also likely that the floors fell, cascading upon each other before the shell imploded upon itself.

I miss having multiple posts in a day too

[Taco-Calamitous]

There are people who believe that we let the Japanese attack us at Pearl Harbor, too, and there's a lot of controversy around the Gulf of Tonkin incident, which led to direct US involvement in Vietnam. I read about the Gulf of Tonkin incident in one of my history classes, but I don't remember the exact claims the text made. They were far more incriminating than what I'm finding online right now, however, IIRC. Regardless, there's so many crazy things I've heard over the years about the US government that, while I'm skeptical about it, I also don't count it out. There are always compelling arguments for and against things, and given the current mess that is US foreign affairs, in the Middle East and elsewhere, I have a hard time wrapping my head around all of it. There's nuance to everything, and people who are absolutely certain about one side of an argument are probably doing themselves a disservice.

Also, hi Yoko! I'm always around. Although usually I'm lurking on Twatter, so it's easier to find me there. We still follow each other on there, I think, lol.

[Pete]

Oh everything is a conspiracy these days. It's hard to believe that the government would "allow" certain events to happen and people to die, and on the other hand, it's not.

For good or bad, the internet has really been a tool for conspiracy theorists/ truthers/ whatever to have a voice. Sometimes they can seem incredibly convincing, other times it's a bunch of times foil hat wackiness.

[Clint]

There's nothing wacky about it. Bush did 9/11, the earth is flat, tornadoes don't actually exist, dragons are real, vaccines cause cancer, and I might have AIDS.

I also can't remember what potatoes are.

[Pete]

Mind control drugs

[Master Garland]

While I agree that most of those conspiracies are silly there is one exception. Vaccines.. while I'm not necassarily an anti-vaxxer in the sense of thinking that they try to poison people with them; I don't however agree with them being forced on children especially newborns. If more women would breast feed their babies for the full term where it's needed to nurse.. while having a healthy diet(no alcohol, tobacco, drugs, etc) then that alone would greatly improve the natural health of babies. People seem to forget for whatever reason that a woman's breastmilk contains antibodies(her immune cells are present in her milk) for every or most illness she ever got in her life. Breastmilk provides much needed immune support for babies(that lack a viable immune system) while providing the best optimal nutrition for the developing child. I never got a smallpox vaccine or as far as I know most any vaccine as a baby besides maybe a few exceptions and I've never gotten pox in my life and am pretty dang healthy, hardly ever getting sick. I also never get flu vaccines and get sick maybe once every 3 years. Pro-vaxxers are sometimes equally ridiculous for thinking that vaccines should be a viable substitute for simply and naturally taking care of ones health through proper diet, hydration, supplementation, and exercise. Also, vaccines are preserved with a mercury base which I can't imagine is ideal for the human body. Now I'm not saying 'all' vaccines are causing autism or any other issue on the scale that the radical extreme anti-vaxxers claim but imperfections in manufacturing will always take place and there may be some vials filled with a measurable mercury concentration imbalance that may cause an issue on some RARE cases.

The issue with most people is they either subscribe too strongly on one side of an issue never attempting to find middle ground. Possessing a more moderate and balanced position regarding these types of issues is ideal.