Anyone up for some fun ;)

[Tiffany]

So today Ontario has decriminalized prostitution.

The judge who ruled on this said that the current laws make it very unsafe for sex workers, and this is going to help make it better for them.

I don't get how legalizing a "problem" will make it better, but hey ho I guess. (Pun not intended )

In all honesty I feel that if someone wants to make money off sex, then why not? But at the same time this law really makes me feel conflicted. Its almost like it sets a precedent. People smoking pot aren't going to go away either, so should we legalize that as well to protect the pot smokers?

I'm all over the place on this. Was curious what anyone else thinks.

[che]

Moral of the story is people are going to do things whether it's legal or not. If it's doing more harm than good to have a law (more people in jail for silly laws preventing them from doing something that doesnt affect people in a majorly negative way, gangs selling drugs instead of the government, etc) then why not legalize it?

So more power to them. It potentially keeps more rapists off the streets, makes both parties happy (one receives a service, one receives money).

Also doesnt "decriminalize" mean it still might be illegal, but it's just not counted as a felony if you're caught?

[Alpha]

In New Zealand, prostitution is not only decriminalised, it's legal. There's even a union for prostitutes.

The basic argument in favour for legalisation was that prostitution was happening, regardless of how some politicians would prefer to sweep it under the rug and ignore it. Because it was happening, but illegal, the Green Party argued that it made sex workers vulnerable. Not only were they committing a crime by being prostitutes, there was no way they could receive protection if they were treated badly (by customers, or 'pimps' (IDK if there ever were any though) -- there is a difference between receiving money for sex and rape. If they were raped, or beaten, or anything, to who could they turn? They wouldn't be asked questions by a doctor, but the perpetrators of the violence against the women (the majority of sex workers are female) would not be held accountable. A prostitute could go to the police and say they were raped, but they would be in trouble for prostitution.

By definition, a criminalised sex worker industry is a black market: both parties to the exchange (money for sex) are committing a crime. There is no incentive for either party to go to the police. For prostitutes, it was a very unsafe situation.

In addition, and very importantly, criminalisation aided the spread of HIV/AIDS and other sexually-transmitted diseases. A client could not be made to wear a condom if the industry is illegal and regulation therefore impossible.

Now, with prostitution legalised, sex workers are ensured a fair wage; they exclusively work in brothels (no women on the street; reduced vulnerability); they have supervisors; they keep records of who comes and goes; they are taxed on their income and business; it is a matter of law for a client to wear a condom; a sex worker can refuse to do anything she feels uncomfortable doing; clients can be expelled from a premises for behaving inappropriately (ex-contractually); sex workers are required to be given any form of contraception they choose (however I'm unsure if it's mandatory to take the pill, for instance); and so on and so forth.

It is quite possibly the most sensible piece of legislating ever performed, in my opinion.

The only tension that has arisen is the location of brothels. Understandably, most people don't want to live near one (noise; traffic; and, well, it offends middle-class sensibility, probably). And they certainly don't want them near schools.

Most of them are located in light-industrial areas. The one nearest my house, 'Paris', is opposite the gym, next to a mechanic. It's about a four-minute walk away, tops, in the next street.

However some have been controversial. One managed to slip through the cracks and was approved to open (and was briefly functional) across the road from an intermediate school (age 12, 13, 14, approximately).

I think the age required to be a prostitute is 18, although consensual sex is legal at 16. That seems an odd disconnect.

And with the marijuana comment, Tiff, the same arguments apply. Vote Green.

[Tiffany]

Weed is decriminalized here, too.

I totally get what you are saying, and agree. My only thought is with those being legal, what's next? Although I hate saying that, because I remember when Canada was in the works of legalizing gay marriage people said that prostitutes and weed would be next. I remember being so irritated by those comments, but now here we are.

I like the idea of brothels, I like how it gets women off the street. I watched an episode of Penn & Teller Bullshit once that dealt with prostitution and visited Nevada, where brothels are legal. It was pretty interesting!

But yeah, stuff that I thought was preposterous when they legalized gay marriage is now happening. Curious to see what the next item up for legalization will be. Any guesses?

[Lily]

So today Ontario has decriminalized prostitution.

The judge who ruled on this said that the current laws make it very unsafe for sex workers, and this is going to help make it better for them.

I don't get how legalizing a "problem" will make it better, but hey ho I guess. (Pun not intended )

In all honesty I feel that if someone wants to make money off sex, then why not? But at the same time this law really makes me feel conflicted. Its almost like it sets a precedent. People smoking pot aren't going to go away either, so should we legalize that as well to protect the pot smokers?

I'm all over the place on this. Was curious what anyone else thinks.

Much the same feelings on this as you I think

I guess, it's keeping women safer, but will it stop them working the streets still? Is this legalising brotehels like, or street walking? I don't think that would ever be safe, but would certain women ever stop doing that? I can't see a respectable (Lol) brothel, hiring a hooker who is only selling herself for her addiction, so surely, these women will still remainon the streets? Unless there are gunna be less respectable establishents (lol again) that's 'cheaper' kinda like the Netto of prostitution, when 'Arrods is up the road......

Im high as a kite on pain killers/antibiotics, so I hope that makes sense..haha

I can't see no harm in it being made legal, whatever floats your boat etc... but on the other hand... eh I dunno. Can't say it's a career path I'd want to take *twirls moustache*

[DragonHeart]

Alpha's hit the nail on the head here. I don't agree with prostitution but I wholeheartedly support protecting the men and women for whom it is a profession. Considering how many sex scandals we have in the US at any given time, you'd think it would be in politicians' interests to do the same here.

The oddest disconnect of all seems to be how squeamish Americans in general are about sexuality. Not the image of it, obviously, but the practice, particularly when you get into the alternative forms of it. For being the land of the free we're sure concerned with what everyone else is doing.

~DragonHeart~

[Tiffany]

The oddest disconnect of all seems to be how squeamish Americans in general are about sexuality. Not the image of it, obviously, but the practice, particularly when you get into the alternative forms of it. For being the land of the free we're sure concerned with what everyone else is doing.

~DragonHeart~

I suppose that happened when the Puritans came over? I agree, as well. People need to stop worrying about what others are doing if it isn't hurting anyone.

[DragonHeart]

I believe that does have a lot to do with it. We were ultra conservative at the beginning and while a lot of it should no longer apply in a modern society, somehow those old ways of thinking just keep carrying over from one generation to the next. We've ended up as a country of many freedoms and even more prejudices. It literally makes no sense.

~DragonHeart~

[Chez Daja]

I think that prostitution should definately be legalized everywhere. If brothels were actually solid, legal businesses then 'pimps' wouldn't exist and prostitutes would be in far lesser danger than they currently are. Not only that but if they had a difficult customer, prostitutes would be able to report the incident rather than suffer in silence.

As for legalizing weed, I'm totally for it. Who hasn't enjoyed a good joint now and then?

[GypsyElder]

When it comes to the prostitution part, you got me, I have no idea; although Chez does have a point in which it would probably be overall, safer for people involved.

For the marajuina part, I'm not so sure. I've had this conversation multiple times with people I know. To say that absolutely nothing negative will come from legalizing it is strange to me. It's not something I can point out off the bat but in my opinion there will be some kind of negative backlash from legalizing marajuana. To avoid whatever it may be,maybe it's best to keep it illegal?

[SOLDIER #819]

To say that absolutely nothing negative will come from legalizing it is strange to me. It's not something I can point out off the bat but in my opinion there will be some kind of negative backlash from legalizing marajuana.

Everyone will start melting into their couches.

I don't believe it's so much about whether or not legalizing marijuana will yield purely positive effects, but simply which choice yields a better result. Alpha outlined a number of reasons why prostitution may be better off legalized. The prohibition of alcohol is another example of what happens when you haphazardly ban something. The severity of the effects vary depending on the nature of what's being banned, but the arguments are more or less the same: you will inevitably have an unregulated and untaxed black market for the stuff and government spending will be used to enforce it. Not to mention its potential as medicine.

Even if there is some sort of backlash, the gain may be greater than whatever the loss is.

[Chez Daja]

I guess one of the reasons that I'm all for the legalization of marijuana other than the fact that I have experimented with it in the past and found it to be a completely pleasant experience is that my uncle had MS.

Over the years, he tried every experimental drug the doctors would give him. He developed the illness in his early thirties. Over time, as his body began to shut down and he was confined everyday to a wheelchair. None of the experimented treatment was working -- he was so desperate to live.
Eventually none of his limbs worked anymore and he was in constant agony. He said the only thing that made him feel better was the marijuana people had given him in hopes to kill the pain.

Time passed and he lost the ability to speak -- in other words, his only form of communication was blinking and eventually, he died.

My point is that marijuana isn't going to cure the whole world. I know it wouldn't have cured my uncle, but I know that he would have experienced a lot less pain if he'd been able to use it exclusively throughout his illness.

[Tiffany]

I guess one of the reasons that I'm all for the legalization of marijuana other than the fact that I have experimented with it in the past and found it to be a completely pleasant experience is that my uncle had MS.

Over the years, he tried every experimental drug the doctors would give him. He developed the illness in his early thirties. Over time, as his body began to shut down and he was confined everyday to a wheelchair. None of the experimented treatment was working -- he was so desperate to live.
Eventually none of his limbs worked anymore and he was in constant agony. He said the only thing that made him feel better was the marijuana people had given him in hopes to kill the pain.

Time passed and he lost the ability to speak -- in other words, his only form of communication was blinking and eventually, he died.

My point is that marijuana isn't going to cure the whole world. I know it wouldn't have cured my uncle, but I know that he would have experienced a lot less pain if he'd been able to use it exclusively throughout his illness.

If your uncle lived here he could've had a prescription for it. My SIL has a medicinal Marijuana use card, and is legally allowed to smoke it anywhere someone is allowed to smoke a cigarette and is legally allowed to carry a certain amount on her.

There's a big difference between people who need it for medicinal pain management and recreational users though.

[Heartless Angel]

Though I personally don't support prostitution, nor would I ever pay for sex, unlike (whats seems to be) an overwhelming majority of people, I admit that it's absolutely none of my damned business what other people do or buy. This law makes tons of sense. You don't like prostitution, don't pay for sex, problem solved. You don't need to keep everyone else from doing it just because it's not your cup of tea. You don't need a ban to keep something out of your own life.

The point about prohibition was excellent. Very much the same thing here. A ban on something everyone wants and is going to use regardless doesn't solve any problems, it just creates more of them. Legalizing weed would be a good move as well. No longer would gangs profit from it, the government could tax it, regulate quality on it, there aren't really any downsides.

As far as I'm concerned, moral taboos have absolutely no place in law, period.

[Hyzenthlay]

Here in England cannabis and prostitution are illegal. Gay marriage isn't possible but we do have 'civil partnerships'. All of these things, in my oppinion, should be legal. They work on a person to person basis. What I mean by this is that they only affect the people doing it. If it doesn't affect society of any outsider then I don't see the point in punishing it. I don't mean, of course, that I'd legalise everything that fits in with this catagory of crime. That would get out of hand e.g- heroin I understand as you are protecting a person from themselves and (from what I assume) these people can't stop on their own. Maybe I'm wrong there but meh. The laws I've listed above are things that people are plainly aware they are doing, and aren't so mind/ body altering altering that they can't help themselves stop. I feel, as others have said, that the police could concentrate on much worse crimes if things like these were decriminalized.

Hyz.

[sayian]

idk what i think about the prostitution thing but that situation and legalizing weed are way too different conversations.... u have any idea how many criminals we would put out of business if we legalized pot... how much money they wouldnt have to buy guns, getaway vehicles, and the power theyd lose on the street...if people wanna GET high, thats between them and thier family.. if they want, their gonna do it anyway.. but we wouldnt have criminals getting rich from that.. and this is comming from som1 who dosent smoke at all

[GIFTSHOPING]

Wan't to hear something fun? In my country there is no law against prostitution,but if you are Pimp you gets it

[Keigo12]

Moral issues aside by legalizing prostitution/marijuana the government can collect tax dollars further helping the state as a whole.

[Rowan]

well if its decriminlized the government can make money off it with tax. Its hardly genuis but its a smart move on their part. Imagine how much crime would be reduced if all drugs were legal and sold at a reasonable price. although there would probably more cases of violence, overdose, dependancy etc which would increase the costs of money needed to be funded into hospitals, police stations, more people in jail etc. It wouldnt turn turn out to be equal and it would produce lower quality citizens. they probably already thought this one through.

[Keigo12]

I actually don't see legalizing prostitution and marijuana making lower quality citizens. First there would be age restrictions like there is for drinking and purchasing cigarettes and porn. This would deter/reduce the number of younger people dependent on it. Plus true education of the dangers associated could begin and it would be easier for those with addictions to seek help. Plus gdp would increase since marijuana would be produced locally instead of smuggling across borders.

This really comes down to moral issues.

[Rowan]

I actually don't see legalizing prostitution and marijuana making lower quality citizens. First there would be age restrictions like there is for drinking and purchasing cigarettes and porn. This would deter/reduce the number of younger people dependent on it. Plus true education of the dangers associated could begin and it would be easier for those with addictions to seek help. Plus gdp would increase since marijuana would be produced locally instead of smuggling across borders.

This really comes down to moral issues.

I think the bad outweighs the good. If we had everyone using Ice, heroin and cocaine (just to name 3) I would say that alone would produce lower quality citizens. The only people who would decide not to use them would be the ones who have a moral issue with them because we know that people will use them reguardless of their health and status.

EDIT:
Also nothings stopping people from buying the drugs for kids. Im pretty sure we all had our older brothers and sisters or even strangers buy us restricted items when we were younger. I remember many a nice chap who would happily take my cash and buy me 6 pack of smirnoff double blacks.

[Selcopa]

Definitely think regulating the sex industry is smarter than trying to ban it. Customers who seek out a prostitute now are safe because they can be confident in the safety of who they have sex with. And while demand will obviously go up, the demand for unlicensed prostitution will go down dramatically, and still be illegal, resulting in a loss of revenues for gangs and organized crime. The question will be if the organized crime will give it up, or if they will be able to infiltrate the system.

As far as medical marijuana(in michigan), it's such a joke, i would be surprised if there was 1 person who used it for medical purposes, for every 10 people that use it recreational, because I know 10 people that use it recreational, and i don't know anyone that uses it medically.

[Keigo12]

I think the bad outweighs the good. If we had everyone using Ice, heroin and cocaine (just to name 3) I would say that alone would produce lower quality citizens. The only people who would decide not to use them would be the ones who have a moral issue with them because we know that people will use them reguardless of their health and status.

EDIT:
Also nothings stopping people from buying the drugs for kids. Im pretty sure we all had our older brothers and sisters or even strangers buy us restricted items when we were younger. I remember many a nice chap who would happily take my cash and buy me 6 pack of smirnoff double blacks.

I must apologize for my ambiguity I was in no way saying legalized cocaine or any other hardcore drug that have proven to cause mental or other damage should ever be legalized.
Yes I would agree underage people would find ways to still get it but the number of underage smokers would decline in number and frequency. Currently it is just as illegal to smoke pot at 15 as it is 18 and 21 (juveee laws aside).

[Rowan]

In the end, the question seems to me to be something like "Is it okay to legalise potentially (and always) harmful drugs and make them available to everyone over 18, a good thing?"
I would automatically say no. Then I would take into account the lower rates in crime and I would still say no beacuse in the end, most of the deaths are from the people using drugs in the first place. The addicts wont dissapear if they become legal and I could easily see a lot of people losing jobs and homes due to drug addiction due to it being legal and available. If we are not talking about severe drugs, and just marijuanna, I can still see people losing jobs and the quality of citizens lowering. As far as prostitution goes, I wasnt aware that it was illegal.