I'm not talking about characters who betray you in-game necessarily, though we can talk about those too. I'm thinking more along the lines of a character you really liked for whatever reason, then they just up and did something that pissed you off so much you ended up hating the character.
Mine is Anders in Dragon Age II.
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Mine is the ever hated Algus/Argath from Final Fantasy Tactics. I legitimately liked him at first. I dunno if it was the blonde hair, or the bravery that boarderlined stupidity but he kinda reminded me of me and I liked it.
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Originally Posted by HUNK
This.
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What about it?
You said what I was going to say.
I liked him at first, then he did that.
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Ezio Auditore from the Assassin's Creed games. He was a good an honorable man in Assassin's Creed II and Assassin's Creed Brotherhood, but in Assassin's Creed Revelations, he's nothing more than a mass murderer.
Sure, he still assassinates bad people, but he did start a fire in Capadocia, which I'm sure many thousands of innocent people thereafter died from smoke inhalation.
The first tenet of the assassin's creed is "stay your blade from the flesh of an innocent." Although Ezio didn't necessarily directly kill anybody in Capadocia with his blades, he was the cause of their deaths. After that scene, I lost all respect for the character, I'm glad he's dead and no longer the protagonist, and I can never replay Assassin's Creed II or Brotherhood again.
Not sure if trolling.
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Is it necessary to always assume that I'm trolling? I'm dead serious like 75% of the time.
Another betrayal I thought of was Big Boss from Metal Gear. He was a good man at the start of the game. He provided you with good intel, and supported you the entire first half of your mission. Then he gets weird. He begins to lead you in the wrong direction, begins to lead you straight into enemies or traps. Come to find out, he's trying to stop you, because he is the mastermind behind the whole Outer Heaven Uprising.
That part always confused me. If he was the mastermind behind the uprising, why would his intel at the start of the mission be accurate?
Sometimes you have to pick one of two evils and sacrifice people in order to kill the greater evil which would do way more damage in the long run. Would you? I would. Would be a hard thing to do and would probably scar me emotionally forever but you gotta do what you gotta do. I'm sure if the afterlife exists, those people would understand.
Nope. You never sacrifice people. That's not the way you get things done. Like in a game of chess. I see my opponents making stupid moves and deliberately sacrificing their pawns. There is no reason to sacrifice your pawns. In fact, it's stupid to sacrifice your pawns, because if you protect all of your pieces equally, and think before you act, everything always works out to your advantage in the end.
If sacrifice is your best option, then it's obvious that you haven't thought about the situation, and are simply reacting irrationally.
True. I don't see why anybody would have a problem with some jackass assuming that their lives are dispensable.
I felt the same as you Dragonheart. I wanted to be able to undo or stop it from happening, but it is a critical point in the plot, so I knew there was no way Bioware would have been bold enough to allow you to direct their story. One of my complaints, which there are many with DA2, was there were no good picks for partners. Anders was the only one that I had any slight interest in and he really wasn't that appealing to me. But then he does what he does. I was like you, I told him to leave the party. But after going through up to the final boss without him I realized I needed a healer and he was the only one. >< So I let him back in because I needed him. But it's funny, because one of my co-workers, when that happened she just killed Anders out right. ^^; Everyone takes betrayal differently.
I guess my own pick would probably be Hobbs from Wing Commander III. He was a really cool character and a great wingman. When I was first starting the game he was the only one that actually seemed like a reliable and competent fighter. Then it happens, I think I figured out the reason he was so good was because he a spy and he was getting free kills almost. Never used him ever again in any of my playthroughs of the no matter how terrible of a wingman I had to pick from.
I have a specific way I handle traitors in games though. Once I learn that they are, if I ever play the game again, I never use them period. I completely remove them from whatever group I'm in. No matter how useful or good they are. They are forever traitors and I banish them. Even if they come back, they never re-earn my trust.
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Wrong mate. Sacrifice is often one of chess's strongest and most valuable moves. Bobby Fisher was king at that. And who really cares what they think, if in afterlife those other people I've saved will thank me and give me credit and gifts and what not. It's not about the sacrifice, it's about seeing the big picture and doing what's best for mankind in general. If sacrifice means saving mankind or preserving a nation or culture or many nations or ideas of peace, justice and democracy, then so be it. Not sacrificing means negligence and apathy for the future, if choosing one of 2 evils is a must.
Last edited by Odin1199; 09-06-2014 at 09:55 PM.
There is no sacrifice in chess if you know how to play. The game can be won in three moves without losing a single piece.
It doesn't matter what the people you save think. You still sacrificed the lives of innocent people. You are a mass murderer. You will not see them in the afterlife, because you will be rotting in the deepest depths of hell. It is completely about the sacrifice, because it is neither your place nor your responsibly to decide the fate of other people's lives, especially if you intend to take their lives.
If you have to take the lives of innocent people, it's the wrong decision. If that's truly your best option, you need to sit down and think about another way to solve the situation, because mass murder and genocide is not the right answer. Sacrifice is, in fact, the easy way out of any situation. It's a fallback for cowards that aren't smart enough to understand the value of human life.
It doesn't matter whether you think something is right or wrong in these types of situations. Whatever you do will result in you being a murderer in the end. If you decide not to sacrifice people, more will die and you will bear witness to their fate and there will be many times you'll be hit with the fact that you killed more than you could've saved.
And again, sacrifice in chess is sometimes the best move, because it can force the opponent to take it. If he doesn't, then more damage will be done.
It's not your choice to decide the fate of people's lives. If you have to kill innocent people to get the job done, then the job doesn't deserve to be done by you. Let somebody who's better than you do it. You know, somebody who won't resort to genocide.
Going back to video game betrayals, instead of starting that fire in Capadocia, Ezio should have done the noble thing and killed himself.
A sacrifice in chess can lead to your defeat, because the more pawns you sacrifice, the less protected your king is.
I know this has little to nothing to do with the subject at hand but I just wanted to mention that I love how this became an argument over the moral decisions involved in sacrificing pawns in chess... Rest those pawns souls...
Anyway I also wanted to add another douchebag to the list of douchebaggery. While it's not exactly a betrayal, it's kinda the opposite actually, he wrongs you from the very beginning of the game and once you finally find him and prepare to bring down the house on his sorry hide, he asks if you're cool with joining him! Who does this crap?! Cowards, that's who. I'm of course talking about Benny from Fallout New Vegas. It's not really a betrayal, but surely this is just as bad. I like to think of it as the other side of the same coin, this dude was established from the opening cutscene to be the bad guy, he tried (and as far as you knew at that point) succeeded in killing you! I understand that Fallout is the type of game to give a player so many options that they can choose to join or destroy just about anyone but still, I don't think the main bad guy should be one of those options... They should just give you many options on how you want him dealt with. Perhaps as a slave of some sort, but I digress.
The way all you guys circle **** over FF6, youd think someone might have mentioned the Kefka betrayal. I thought that was a pretty good betrayal, as far as betrayals go, of course.
Last edited by Rowan; 09-07-2014 at 04:34 PM.
Has someone mentioned Kain from FF4 yet? Yeah, he was possessed, but that bastard betrayed me twice. I found that very annoying.
This is one that really frustrated me and it's a good one to bring up. At first when Kain got possessed I was certain that once he broke free from the mind control that we'd be best bros just like old times, and then he did it again and I just started refusing to use him. I hate Kain on FFIV now, I'll only use him on Dissidia 012.
Big Boss thought Snake being a rookie he woild fail, return to the states and give false intel. Now with all the material added afterwards Big Boss probably knew Snake was one of the Les Enfants Terrible. So why he would not think he may succeed is unknown.
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