WWE Wrestling

I haven't watched WWE in years, not since that cool Hispanic dude(his name escapes me..) died. I love Undertaker just because of his entrance. This is no joke, but I actually saw Batista at a small airport in Fayetteville, North Carolina after doing some Wrestlemania event in Raliegh(I guess he didn't want to use the huge airport over there. He wore a long sleeved shirt to cover his MANY tatooes. My dad and several other people asked if it was really him but he denied it. It's not like he can hide who he is...oh, my apoligies, I was rambling. By the way can anyone tell me what happened to that freak of a wrestler named Bogeyman who scared the s#!t out of Booker T.???

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Originally Posted by KeybladerXIII

I haven't watched WWE in years, not since that cool Hispanic dude(his name escapes me..) died.

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I presume it must be since the death of Eddie Guerrero. Which puts it at around...two or three years ago? Lot has happened since then, but the general consensus is that WWE is still stable despite almost trying to screw up...on purpose.

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By the way can anyone tell me what happened to that freak of a wrestler named Bogeyman who scared the s#!t out of Booker T.???

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He got offed recently by the company. Probably will do like most others and move to TNA. Though, his character got into the realm of pointlessness. Much like what's happening to Kane, and some other wrestlers that are slowly turned down until they are released.

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Originally Posted by T.G. Oskar

I presume it must be since the death of Eddie Guerrero. Which puts it at around...two or three years ago? L

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It's actually five years ago.

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Originally Posted by T.G. Oskar

Though, his character got into the realm of pointlessness.

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His character started out in the realm of pointlessness.

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Originally Posted by Dr. Egon Spengler

It's actually five years ago.

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Actually, it was about three and a half. He died in November 2005 (just before he was scheduled to beat Batista for the World Title, sadly enough).

Speaking of the Boogeyman, I actually thought he had the potential to become a good character. If he had turned heel, he would have been good.

Backlash is looking pretty good, except for the six-man tag match. The match I am looking foward to the most is Steamboat vs Jericho.

i really really really hate to say this but i hope edge beats cena as well.......not because i like edge, but because i want the balance back in wwe. one world title for raw and one for smackdown....steamboat and y2j?.. i dunno know about that one... they should just let steamboat win...make it a good match of course but let him win if its gonna be the mans last match......the 6 man tag for the wwe title is just dumb thats all i gotta say about that....... the original boogyman had potential, but this last guy they had sucked. i know there was 2 diff ones cause the belly buttons were diff , the original had an inny and the last guy had an outie..........R.I.P..EDDIE....your still missed by millions...........that is a random match with punk and kane....where did that even come from?.......i been hoping jeff beats his brother since before wrestlemainia so of course i want him to win this sunday ......
when was the last time the reff actually stopped a match? i just watched big show vs taker this morning and am lost cause i don't remember when a ref stopped a match

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Originally Posted by foster kid

i really really really hate to say this but i hope edge beats cena as well.......not because i like edge, but because i want the balance back in wwe. one world title for raw and one for smackdown....

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I disagree. I don't think that the World Heavyweight Championship should leave Raw. That way, eventually, they'll be forced to crown a new undisputed champion, and wrestling will go back to the way it should be, with one world title per company.

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Originally Posted by foster kid

the 6 man tag for the wwe title is just dumb thats all i gotta say about that.......

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It's especially stupid since Randy Orton is in the match. I'd rather slit my wrists, sitting under an elephant while it's taking a dump, while doing crack, than watch one of his matches.

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Originally Posted by foster kid

i been hoping jeff beats his brother since before wrestlemainia so of course i want him to win this sunday ......

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Jeff doesn't deserve it, just as he didn't deserve the WWE title a few months back. He's been suspended twice due to drug problems, as well as fired multiple other times. Matt, on the other hand, while he was fired once for personal reasons, has been with the company since the late 1990s, and has never been suspended. What they promote by putting the title on Jeff is that the worst employees headline while the best employees are stuck in midcard.

but wait a min here isn't this company all about what the fans want? granted there are fans that don't like jeff hardy just like there are fans that don't like taker....... but if its about the fans then jeff should win(not really a world title, cause it didn't fit him) but just against his brother at least once at a ppv.

hate orton that much do we? lol me too

but until they do unite the titles again its prob gonna be a lil bland on smackdown......unless edge and y2j team up.......wich wouldn't work cause of there massive egos......but the real question is if they unite the titles then who would be the ultimate champ? i want cena to kick the crap out of edge and "end" this feude but i want a title on smackdown tooo.......sigh just can't win i guess lol

and speaking of uniting titiles............ i wish they would go back to one womans title....

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Originally Posted by foster kid

but wait a min here isn't this company all about what the fans want? granted there are fans that don't like jeff hardy just like there are fans that don't like taker....... but if its about the fans then jeff should win(not really a world title, cause it didn't fit him) but just against his brother at least once at a ppv.

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The fans obviously like drug addicts, and WWE promotes that, which is very hypocritical of them, considering how strict the drug policy in the company is.

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Originally Posted by foster kid

but the real question is if they unite the titles then who would be the ultimate champ?

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They should have CM Punk win it. He already has the Money in the Bank. All he has to do is challenge both champions to a triple threat unification.

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Originally Posted by foster kid

and speaking of uniting titiles............ i wish they would go back to one womans title....

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Apparently one is for women who have wrestling ability, and the other is a title for eye candy. They should also get rid of the ECW championship (as well as the show altogether,) and the United States Championship. There are far too many titles in one company. WWE's problem is that it's trying to be it's own competition, because like the assholes that the WWE executives are, they didn't think before buying out all of their competition.

Well, I must say there's a hint of truth at foster's words. Mostly, because it brings a tpoic barely challenged.

What's most important, the fans or the company's prestige?

No matter how bad the choices look, the WWE execs realized they had something they couldn't imagine: they have pretty much singlehandedly shaped fanhood into what they exactly want. The biggest example is Cena: he's a mediocre wrestler (who should train and do more than what he currently does, humane efforts be damned) who's right now constantly poised as the next big thing. Heck, they wanna place him as the next Hogan, not realizing the fact that it was because of Hogan that wrestling went the way it was. As well, they are trying to sell the shows to the fans, not to the followers.

Allow me to go deeper into this. For this purpose, "fans" are those who enjoy a wrestling company and very specific wrestlers because they enjoy the gimmicks; they are those who have the money to buy the merchandise, the spirit to cheer for those to whom they prefer, and to mock those who they despise. "Followers" are those who enjoy the very concept of wrestling itself, and that make smarter choices when choosing their favorites; they don't easily buy most angles and gimmicks, they look for technique and mic skills more than to feeling, and most of the time are the most vocal fans of wrestling itself. On a nutshell; fans are fans, followers are the true fans.

What's the proportion of fans upon followers? And what is WWE, a WRESTLING promotion company, a wrestling PROMOTION company, or a wrestling promotion COMPANY? Right now, it's a bit of two and three; it has foregone wrestling for promotion and money-making. Which is the reason why Cena is unbeatable; because Cena-fans love him.

For WWE, the most important thing as of now is the fans, not the followers. Followers are those who they need to convince so that they don't lose their money, and those who they need to mock so that they protest and hence provoke impromptu promotion. Since what promotes best: a billboard, an Internet ad, or a controversial article?

As for Jeff: while I don't condone the fact that Matt has been relegated to Midcarder and only remains as Main-Eventer because his brother is one too, there's one important thing I must recall. Gimmicks =/= real life wrestlers. You can't blame Jeff for his troubles, if he's a real good wrestler with the charisma enough to attract the fans AND the followers. It's important that he realizes that drugs are destructive for his organism (well, a case can be done for marijuana, but Jeff's cases have been for even worse drugs, so the statement is relevant). But that he's a good wrestler and that he deserves to be a main-eventer just as much as his brother? Sure. You can't go and punish a gimmick for what he does in real life (aside from anabolical steroids, because it's tantamount to cheating; I'll speak of that later); a gimmick is a gimmick, real life is real life. It would be the same to have a fan do something bad to, say, Randal K. Orton or Chris Irvine, for what their characters "Randy Orton" or "Chris Jericho" do in wrestling. Sure, something has to be done (and it was done: when CM Punk won the first Money in the Bank, it was because the WWE punished Jeff for his second drug case), but you can't turn them into pariahs because of a mistake. Everybody makes mistakes once in a while; and worse, drug addicts fall over and over again, because their willpower isn't as strong as it was before. And you can be clean for about 10 years, and you can feel the urge and fall again (I believe this last bit is scientifically proven) This doesn't mean you'll leave someone with talent and who might work wonders for wrestling because of it; you got to keep a balance. It was fair that Jeff was punished for running afoul of the law, denying him a chance at the title; it's fair that he attempts to do community service and that his talent has allowed him a chance for the gold; it's completely unfair that Matt hasn't been given the same chance and a proper run as a champ for his effort.

And think of this; if Matt's work for the WWE must deserve him a champ run, then you are pretty much agreeing that Cena should be a champ because he barely has a life. I'd advice thinking about what you say.

Now, steroids. Mostly because of Chris Benoit, whose wrestling skills and good gimmick were stained because of his unfortunate incident. It was quite unexpected, nobody imagined he would do that, and it's not easily forgivable. That shouldn't stain his talent at wrestling (even though it can be now questionable), even though his talent was mostly focused on grappling and holding, with some aerial. And as far as I understand, his rage was caused by 'roids, IIRC. It's hard to say he was a good or bad person because of an unfortunate incident, and it's pretty hard now to determine if he was a proper athlete or if he was a fluke. It's equally as wrong to state he was a cheat because he used steroids, when his array of moves only sparingly used strength, and when most of the concept of doing a hold is making someone "tap out" without causing more harm. A proper grappler should know how to do a proper grapple so that the other person won't receive lasting bruises; it requires a bit of talent, a bit of cultivated talent at least. How much of his was raw or cultivated talent, and how much was artificially induced? Well, right now we can't imagine, but surely it's not 0/100%, and surely it must be close enough in proportion to consider he was quite talented. Sure, you can make a case with that, but you can't tarnish what he provided in wrestling with his real life antics. You can aid, you can punish, you can demand a disciplinary action, but you can't blame the gimmick for what the real-life person did, and viceversa.

Wrapping this up: don't go mixing real life and wrestling gimmicks. You can allow for disciplinary action, but you can't punish a gimmick forever for what his real life interpreter does.

As a final note: kill ECW? That's telling the followers that their opinion is worthless, even more than what it is now. ECW was revived as an attempt to please the followers; turns out that they proved they can't please the followers. Closing ECW is tantamount to allowing them to go forward with it. Better to IMPROVE ECW rather than close it. I'll reserve my opinion towards it until I see how Smackdown! runs nowadays; with the bunch of changes, perhaps Smackdown! will prove that people prefer good stories and good wrestlers than Bulkland and Bulk stories.

well first thanks for takin my side even a lil bit lol

that would be the smartest thing anyone could do (punk challanging both champs at once) "the ultimate oppertunist" edge couldn't even come up with something like that.......

the wwe hasn't bought out all of its major compitition yet.....TNA......i don't know why but its starting to get big and hopefully it will force WWE to get better in time.....and force them to make a better wrestling game,if TNA can make a decent game that is lol

its still dumb to have 2 diff woman titles......when you have a diva champ beating the woman champ....

i don't think they should get rid of the US title cause you do that then you gotta get rid of the intercontinental title.... cause while the bulky big ego guys with not that much talent get the world titles, the guys who work hard and have talent(usually) get the US title and INC title

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Originally Posted by T.G. Oskar

And think of this; if Matt's work for the WWE must deserve him a champ run, then you are pretty much agreeing that Cena should be a champ because he barely has a life. I'd advice thinking about what you say.

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Cena does deserve to be champion. He's the most charismatic guy in the company. Whether you like him or not for his wrestling abilities, there's no denying that he's incredible behind the microphone.

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Originally Posted by T.G. Oskar

As a final note: kill ECW? That's telling the followers that their opinion is worthless, even more than what it is now. ECW was revived as an attempt to please the followers; turns out that they proved they can't please the followers.

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WWE changed ECW so drastically since it's so-called "revival," that there are actually rules. Watch the old ECW. There were no "extreme rules" matches. The only rule was that the match had to end sometime. It was violent wrestling, not this PG "for kids" bullshit that WWE has going now.

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Originally Posted by foster kid

the wwe hasn't bought out all of its major compitition yet.....TNA......i don't know why but its starting to get big and hopefully it will force WWE to get better in time.....

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TNA is another crap wrestling company that won't last another decade. All it is is a bunch of old WWE wrestlers in a bunch of crappy gimmick matches, as if people actually want to any of those matches. Kind of reminds me of WCW. That company sucked, too.

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Originally Posted by foster kid

i don't think they should get rid of the US title cause you do that then you gotta get rid of the intercontinental title.... cause while the bulky big ego guys with not that much talent get the world titles, the guys who work hard and have talent(usually) get the US title and INC title

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The U.S. Title and Intercontinental Title are the exact same title, only packaged a different way, and with a different name. For twenty years, the company only had one mid-card title, so I see no problem going back to only one mid-card title.

WCW almost put WWE out of business don't forget that.....i didn't like WCW either but thats still the fact.

if we go back to one mid card as you call it...........(even though countless great wrestlers have held the INC title, and worked harder and most of the time had better matches then the world title holders) then we will have to let the brand rosters go and let there be just one roster again ..............

I love cena i love his movies and when he is behind the mic... and i do think he derserves the title ......and lets admit it....even though he doesn't have the best in ring ability, he is 200 times better than when he first arrived in the WWE .........

granted there is problems with the WWE but its still great to watch

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Originally Posted by Dr. Egon Spengler

Cena does deserve to be champion. He's the most charismatic guy in the company. Whether you like him or not for his wrestling abilities, there's no denying that he's incredible behind the microphone.

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Well, I loathe his gimmick, just because he tries to do the rapper gimmick that failed him before and tries to mix it with a wannabe soldier of fortune. Mostly, that ridiculous "you can't see me" thing and his recycled attempts at gangsta speak. So yeah, in mic skills, his "ability" is relative. If you like what he spouts out there, well, that's your choice.

As for the old ECW, they had to do it. It was a compromise: bring an old franchise known for its good matches, please the followers, but make it one more money mine. And yeah, they suck on that one. Still doesn't justify blowing it up without even giving it a chance after the draft. It'll be the same as before; two brands leading, each trying to be a different company. And, oddly enough, that works better than inter-brand combat. Let RAW be RAW, let Smackdown! be Smackdown!, let ECW be the good ol' frickin' ECW.

At least, make ECW a more gruesome show and keep it for the followers. That I can agree with. But ditching it? Not my idea of fixing wrestling, at least not until it can be proven that it's hopeless.

Though, speaking of hopeless...Kozlov. Uggh.

Anyways, how about ROH? And how about someone smart bringing translated matches from New Japan? That should do something (skip the gimmicks, focus on people like KENTA for example...should give WWE a run for its money)

In my honest opinion, no other company will ever be able to go up against WWE. WWE is just way to big to have competition, even overseas.

And especially not in the US. TNA? that company is built on wrestlers released by WWE. Most of their main eventer are WWE rejects. Apart from Sting, the MEM is made up of rejects. Half of their champions came from WWE. Even the founder of TNA was rejected from WWE. Besides, with Jeff Hardy, Tomko (even though he was released) and Christian jumping back to WWE, and with Angle and Nash apparently now on good terms with Vince, it's only a matter of time before more jump back.

And now with Lashley in the company? Fail. It won't last long before TNA realise he sucks.

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Originally Posted by foster kid

if we go back to one mid card as you call it...........(even though countless great wrestlers have held the INC title, and worked harder and most of the time had better matches then the world title holders) then we will have to let the brand rosters go and let there be just one roster again ..............

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Not necessarily. When the draft first started, there was only one world title, and what they did was have that champion appear on both shows. The same thing could be done with the Intercontinental champion.

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Originally Posted by T.G. Oskar

Well, I loathe his gimmick, just because he tries to do the rapper gimmick that failed him before and tries to mix it with a wannabe soldier of fortune.

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That rapper gimmick actually started out as a joke. He was Vanilla Ice for Halloween one year, and it just kind of stuck.

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Originally Posted by T.G. Oskar

As for the old ECW, they had to do it. It was a compromise: bring an old franchise known for its good matches, please the followers, but make it one more money mine.

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The new so-called ECW has lost support from all the old ECW fans. I guess the compromise was butchering a good show.

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Originally Posted by T.G. Oskar

At least, make ECW a more gruesome show and keep it for the followers. That I can agree with. But ditching it? Not my idea of fixing wrestling, at least not until it can be proven that it's hopeless.

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WWE has slipped into a really gay "for kids" era. They're not even allowed to show blood anymore. At Wrestlemania, Matt Hardy got busted open, and as soon as he did, a guy with a towel ran down to the ring to clean it up. Do you realize how gay that is?

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Originally Posted by T.G. Oskar

Anyways, how about ROH? And how about someone smart bringing translated matches from New Japan? That should do something (skip the gimmicks, focus on people like KENTA for example...should give WWE a run for its money)

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A lot of good wrestlers came from ROH. First, though, they would need to get sponsored and find a TV spot.

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Originally Posted by Dr. Egon Spengler

You have no idea what you're talking about. Jericho v. Steamboat is going to be the best match on the card. For a guy that hasn't been an active wrestler in nearly 20 years, Steamboat sure as hell hasn't lost a single step. He's a bit slower than he was before, but he's just as awesome. If that match isn't the main event, I'm going to be pissed.

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Well it was hardly the best Match On the Card Now Was it :lol:

Edge v Cena Stole the show Last night

I questioned this match as the Main event but i did not know the Outcome off it was going to be so dramatic Don't know where this will leave Big show Now but Cena is taking time off i heard so that could be his last match for a bit

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Originally Posted by Rufus shinra

Well it was hardly the best Match On the Card Now Was it :lol:

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Yes, it was, as far as wrestling ability is concerned. Entertainment value, though, gains more recognition than pure wrestling talent.

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Originally Posted by Rufus shinra

Edge v Cena Stole the show Last night

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What was that, Edge v. Cena match 42? I'm bored with those two always wrestling each other.

At least it should be the last of Cena vs Edge for at least a little while, considering Cena may be taking some time off again to do some more films. Honestly, this fued has been going on for more than 3 years on and off. I'm just glad they're on separate shows now.

I'm glad Edge is champion again. I like Edge, because he is one of the only believable heels in the company today.

Quick prediction, Jeff Hardy vs Edge- TLC at Extreme Rules.

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Originally Posted by Dr. Egon Spengler

WWE has slipped back into a really gay "for kids" era. They're not even allowed to show blood anymore.

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Fixed.

Really, this is mostly a return to old days, when such bizarre stuff as the Gobbledygooker and Hulk Hogan as a child's hero, along with others such as Robocop teaming up with Sting were commonplace. Except, replace Hogan for Cena and you get the point. But seriously, the old 80's WWF was roughly tuned for kids, and even WCW had its moments.

Also, for Rufus; mostly the match was Edge leading Cena, then using the badly placed gimmick of cheater to use Big Show as a way to change the WHC from brands. At least two good things resulted from that:

1) Smackdown! has an important title, since RAW pretty much sucked all of the titles. Which means that, with the people that remained, the WHC now has some good representation. Though I'd prefer the WWE title, because most of the main eventers now in Smackdown are roughly heavyweights.

2) John Cena is out for a while. Hopefully, for a very long while.

However, the championship matches should now be interesting. First, we have CM Punk and his easily reclaimable Money in the Bank briefcase. Then, there's John Morrison finally alone and easily capable of reaching the top. Jericho can do a very nice run in case they either turn him as a face, or if a face wins the championship to allow Edge to subsume into lower matches. Undertaker can have yet another WHC run, but that's roughly foreseeable. As well, the bookers could push either R-Truth or Shelton Benjamin, although R-Truth could make an interesting Intercontinental Champion.

At least it's better than RAW's WWE title runs. It'll either be HHH or Bulktista. And right now, it looks like Bulktista.

Smackdown is better than RAW in terms of the roster now anyway. Firstly, you have the younger guys, like CM Punk, John Morrison who are like to main event the brand in the near future. Plus, SD! has the better veterans that can still wrestle. Guys like Rey Mysterio (when he's not injured :P), Edge, Jericho, Undertaker, Kane.

All Raw has now is the bigger stars, but the guys that can't wrestle for shit, like Batista, Orton, Big Show, Cena etc.