Let's Be Civilized

[Violet]

So, we've all discussed our thoughts on what's to be done regarding the WG/H and NSFW forums. Right now it's just a matter of time before an Admin sees this and takes action. I'm going to
blowtorch/close this thread in the mean time, since all it's become is one big happy bitch fest. So for now, take this up in VMs, MSN, or PMs. Thanks.


EDIT: Actually, I'm going to leave the thread open for a little longer, since Merlin just brought up some points. I'd like to see what people have to say on that. So, post away. Again, be civilized.

[Merlin]

Hey, if you want to disable WG, go for it dudes. It's not my decision anyway. I'll just give you a quick synopsis of what will happen. Once that forum is turned off, those topics will start magically appearing in GC, among other forums. At first, the mods will be busy closing them and throwing out warnings. They'll have to make a sticky thread in several forums and a global announcement telling people that "word games" are no longer acceptable anywhere on TFF and these messages will be ignored. These topics will continue to be posted until people start getting banned. People just like yourselves will begin standing up against this, claiming mod abuse. These topics were permissible before, why now are they suddenly not permissible? Even people in this very thread who agreed to remove that forum will start claiming that they wanted it closed down, but the topics to remain available, in some fashion or another, contradicting what has been said here. The staff will have to make a hard choice: Continue to warn/ban these people or re-open the forum in some fashion.

For the non-staffers, this is probably no big deal to you. You don't have to live with the consequences. They do. This is one fine example of why I hate forum politics. This has no good outcome.

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As for the 18+ forum, I think the idea has no merit. I have seen plenty of NSFW topics in GC. Seriously, if you need to get more detailed then that you're at the wrong site. Such a forum is a violation of Fuzz's vision. I dislike Steve Jobs, but I'll have to agree with him on one point: If you want adult only material, go somewhere else. That is not what TFF is about.

edit: I have no clue why this is closed...but I was already writing my post and I'm not deleting it.

[Joe]

I could care less about humor and word games being kept or abolished. Alternatively, you could do two subforums, one for logic puzzles and games, and one for humor/timewasting forum games. Alternatively you could make H/WG it's own forum, with it's own moderator, instead of also bogging down the GC mods with the subforum.

Instead of an NSFW board, why not something similar to Xkcd's setup? I've noticed under their general chat board, they have a Member Business type forum, which we already have, and a Love/Sex/Relationships forum, which is member's only. Member's of all ages go to that board for encouragement, advice, polls, etc, and it keeps it all in one place.

Something akin to /QQ/ or /adv/ from 420chan/4chan could be considered as well, for general advice/venting, as long as it's tastefully done. that could be an ID subsection, as I'd assume only serious posts would be allowed there with overly strict rules.

A news/current events forum/sticky might have merit as well, but I'm likely the only one who thinks so.

Just some ideas to toss out there while you fine people are here "deliberating and conjugating the emancipation proclamation." (Bonus points if you guess the show and episode the quote comes from).

I think we all agree that we need some way to stimulate activity in at least SOME manner.

[Pete]

I still think general chat should be more general. Joe's on the right idea, but all of that should still be in general chat. Hell, a CHAT about anything should be in general chat.

I fully agree with Meier saying there should be a regulated type of word games, but hell, add that to Gen chat. There is a difference between those retarded "guess what color I shat" word games that bring out the bottom of the barrel members, and fun stupid games like world domination.

[Violet]

I think there should be a limit to the amount of "Elimination" threads in the WG/H section. So like, from now on, just make it where only two elimination threads can be open at once: one FF elimination, and one other elimination. That would fix the whole 'elimination threads spamming WG/H' section. I could easily keep that under control.

[SOLDIER #819]

Are the elimination threads really having an adverse impact on the forums? Other than them showing up on the Latest Post thing. I don't even bother going in there, so to me it's like they're not even there.

[Jin]

I don't get the whole anti-word games thing. I thought the problem was not enough freedom in the main GC forum rather than too much freedom in another.

What are we arguing about now?

[Tiffany]

I dislike most topics in the H/WG forum. Although I've thought about this a bit more and now am of the opinion that if we axe the H/WG forum then all those spammy topics are going to flood GC?

That definitely doesn't sound appealing to me. I don't want to wade through 50 useless (to me, fun to others I suppose) threads to find something of merit that I would like to post in.

Just my 2.5 (reviewed) cents.

[Victoria]

Well, the topics aren't going to flood GC.

Because if it does end up being axed, obviously the topics are going to all be pruned first.

[Jin]

I'm really confused how this helps anyone.

If we're just going to axe all the word game topics, won't we just be adding to those who find the current scope of what is considered a valid thread oppressive? Wasn't the point to increase the flexibility of GC? Am I just lost here?

[Tiffany]

I figured that, was more thinking along the line that Pete (or was it Rocky? Can't remember who specifically...sorry!) mentioned about just having it all in one area. Like, instead of having them separate put them together?

Maybe I'm on glue this morning. Lemme see if I can find the post.

Aha! It was Pete.

I still think general chat should be more general. Joe's on the right idea, but all of that should still be in general chat. Hell, a CHAT about anything should be in general chat.

I fully agree with Meier saying there should be a regulated type of word games, but hell, add that to Gen chat. There is a difference between those retarded "guess what color I shat" word games that bring out the bottom of the barrel members, and fun stupid games like world domination.

[Jin]

That just seems to go in a circle. Where do we draw the line? How does one determine what is an acceptable "fun stupid" GC thread and what is an unacceptable "bottom of the barrel" GC thread? In the end, won't it still come down to the mods' discretion? Isn't that what started this whole thing in the first place?

We're trying to have our cake and eat it too here.

[Pete]

That's what I'd like to define. I know one members word game is another members bullshit spam thread, but there are some word games that can be fleshed out a little bit.

For instance, whats in your wallet. Why do you have what you do? Is there anything sentimental, do you even have a wallet? Shit like that.

[Jin]

Wouldn't that just replace one group of unhappy posters with another? What's to stop those who like "bullshit spam" threads from claiming mod oppression when their threads get closed?

[Tiffany]

Hate to say it (okay, not reeeally) but Jin's right.

You can't please the masses, there's always going to be someone calling foul. So then it turns into a matter of who's opinion matters more? The ones who want quality threads or the ones who like having fun, spammy threads?

[Jin]

So then it turns into a matter of who's opinion matters more? The ones who want quality threads or the ones who like having fun, spammy threads?

Well the latter's attempted revolution is what prompted the creation of this thread in the first place, but they've since receded into a rather moderate line, so who knows. Neither of those sides really exist of course, as everyone sees themselves as wanting quality threads which are fun, but no one can agree on what that means. Regardless, if we start deciding whose opinions matter more than others then we're right back where we started.

The revolution betrayed!

[Rhaps]

This is sparta! Ocean Eyes was right in using my title in a post earlier lol
Anyway, Mistress Victoria was right, this thread was is and will remain nothing. It was merely an attempt for everyone to voice their opinions and have them maybe make an opinion change/ strengthen with a mod on this. Now, people are just having a great circle of unpleasantness. Sorry for any controversy this has caused, it truly was meant to avoid that.
Back to story, why not instead of a one week test drive of the new sub-forums, let's try a month?

[Jin]

Relax. With only a few exceptions, this thread has been relatively civilized. Especially compared with what preceded it.

[Merlin]

What are you folks actually asking for? I don't think you are all on the same page with this H/WG removal plan. If you remove that forum, two choices arise:

• The WG threads will be allowed in GC.
• The WG threads will not be allowed in GC.

Which is it? If you want them to stay, you're going to be hard-pressed to get the staff to agree to it, especially seeing as how those topics are basically engineered to boost post counts. Right now they are sequestered inside a forum with no permissions.

edit: Oh and the "wallet" idea is bogus. That is already a thread in GC.

[Victoria]

The whole point of this thread is to choose to keep or remove word games entirely. The forum and the threads with it.

If the WG threads are kept, why bother getting rid of the forum at all? That'd just be stupid.

[Merlin]

I don't believe it is. That's why I am asking... because if you read through these posts, there is a split between those who want such topics migrated and those who want them obliterated.

There is of course a third option that I would like to bring up. Instead of removing the H/WG forum, it could be moved directly underneath GC rather than inside it. The name could be changed to something like "Shenanigans" with a description of "Got an interesting word game or a random topic idea that just doesn't fit anywhere? Step right up."

Best of both worlds. All spammy threads/posts, including those currently in GC, can be there, while humor and topics that require more than 3-word posts can be in GC. If it stays it kinda should be separated anyway. I concur that seeing word games as the latest post every time is more than a bit disturbing.

[Victoria]

Hmm.. That sounds like a viable solution that I can agree with.
Sided with what Meier suggested, making them just a wee bit more strict or something like that, with like one elimination thread at a time and whatnot.

I vote for option 3. =O

[Merlin]

Yes, they would need to be weeded down some. Elimination threads could be like tournaments.. you can only do one at a time or something. That forum could be made more palatable with some work put into it. I'm not a fan of spam but you cannot completely obliterate it without some sort of consequences. Spam is a constant problem on any board. You can either give yourself a heart attack trying to keep up with it, or mitigate the problem by giving them something constructive to do with their spam while still keeping it in check.

[che]

I think Merlin really nailed it with the "option 3".

[Tiffany]

I definitely like Option 3 as well.

[Furore]

Merlin for President (so long as Pedro isn't in the running).
Great idea though, simple and addresses the problem some were having directly (that of being even slightly exposed to WG/H titles, teh horrors).

[Meigumi]

I don't really care for the Humor/Games forum, but that doesn't mean I don't want it to die, either.

I say Option 3.

[Jin]

Jeez, guys. Option 3 was brought up in the soapbox thread already. Way to ignore it there.

[Merlin]

So thanks are in order for me reminding people of the idea, yes?

I honestly didn't notice it in there. There was more angst in that thread than a bar full of Final Fantasy characters whining about how their lives were ruined when they had to run off to save the world. I skimmed through it at best. So hey, if someone wants to lay claim to the idea, go for it dudes. I'm not running for office... just throwing out suggestions. What you do with them is up to you.




edit:
Obligatory Disclaimer: The angst comment was sarcasm. If you feel the symptoms of angst, anger, hate, anxiety, depression or any other emotion that could be deemed as "negative" by psychiatric definition after reading that sentence, please take a few moments to collect your thoughts and realize that it was to be taken lightly. Thank you for your time. I now return you to your topic. ^_^

[che]

So thanks are in order for me reminding people of the idea, yes?

I honestly didn't notice it in there. There was more angst in that thread than a bar full of Final Fantasy characters whining about how their lives were ruined when they had to run off to save the world. I skimmed through it at best. So hey, if someone wants to lay claim to the idea, go for it dudes. I'm not running for office... just throwing out suggestions. What you do with them is up to you.




edit:
Obligatory Disclaimer: The angst comment was sarcasm. If you feel the symptoms of angst, anger, hate, anxiety, depression or any other emotion that could be deemed as "negative" by psychiatric definition after reading that sentence, please take a few moments to collect your thoughts and realize that it was to be taken lightly. Thank you for your time. I now return you to your topic. ^_^

I liked you better before you posted this. Your idea still rocks though!