Beta - My Thoughts

[Sean]

I'm sure most won't really give a damn what I think, but oh well.

DISCLAIMER: WALL OF TEXT INC


I'm an "asshole" when it comes to how I think, feel, and react to games. I'm picky, I'm cynical, and I'm hard to impress.

That said, let's get into the first thing that's pissed me off about this game;

I wait 5 days for the beta client's installer to download a 5 gigabyte patch, before giving up. After finding out I can open the .torrent in utorrent and download it with my OWN torrenting client, I try again. I find I'm not the only one suffering from terribad software that's used by SE to torrent out their patch data.

I then wait 4 hours for the beta client installer to INSTALL said large patch. After 4 hours, it's still not moving beyond 30%, I cancel, restart, go again.

Microsoft Security Center pops up with a false positive at 99% crashing the installer. Can I blame SE for that? You bet I can!

After disabling Security Center and redoing the patch for the 4th time, I FINALLY get it installed and go now begin playing.





So, here we are, I'm going through my character selection screen, no really well done explantions of the different combat classes, but I typically stick to the rogue-like and the healers;

The problem, you ask? There are no rogue-like or clear-cut healers in the game. I then do some google searches, to find out that people in the beta trying to be healers are having a rough time of it due to the fact that healing is, apparantly, useless. One heal = aggro.

Oh well, I decide I'll just be a gladiator, I enjoy melee combat.

The character creation screen, this time around, is way way too much. It asks way too many questions, requires way too much information and choices on things that you aren't really explained on how they will affect your character and playstyle for better or for worse.

A surname? Seriously? I don't want to run around with a last name hanging out on my character's head.

The same tired, difficult, clunky controls from Final Fantasy XI return for another appearance.

The same races with new names and nothing remarkably different about them from XI.

An AWFUL lot of grammatical errors for a game that's so near release.

Very, very poorly done UI without even the slightest hint of customization. Changing the resolution broke a lot of the UI elements and put them into very annoying spots.

Thus far, boring and unintuitive combat, but I haven't been in many fights.


I don't think I can even go on from here. I was bored by the time I'd finally finished making my character.



Maybe I'm spoiled from WoW, but as much as people bitch about things in WoW NOT working, that's all "Waahh I have no patience" bullshit. The actual technical issues with this game; the downloader, the patcher, the terrible use of the English language are pretty major, IMO.

And don't say "But it's beta, bro!" I'm playing the version of the game that's already produced to DVD and ready to be sold to North American consumers.


All in all, I'm not impressed. I don't plan on buying this. SquareEnix has not impressed me with a single title of theirs since, hell, probably Final Fantasy IX. I don't know why I possibly thought otherwise about this game.

[Sean]

I know, the whole double posting thing, but to the people who've read this already I want them to see this, and I didn't edit it in earlier, this post is full of the positives! (Mostly) If you (the mod reading this) has an issue, feel free to merge them, or just delete the posts.


So far I've been playing a a Mithra fisher. I JUST finally figured out how to switch classes (It's as easy as equipping a weapon belonging to the class you want to be! Nifty) and get into melee combat. A few more negatives here; the combat system is unforgivingly difficult for someone who didn't start the game off as a combat class. I've died 5 times now just trying to find a mob I can kill. =\ The first time I died took me ages to figure out how to port back to my local Aetheryte.


Fishing is.... ehh. Is it better than WoW's? Yes. It is better than FFXI's (both versions)? Yes! Hard to say if it's worthwhile at this point, since who knows how it interacts with other tradeskills, but it IS enjoyable to fish in this game, at least, if you've ever enjoyed fishing in any other game.... ever.

The graphics are rather nice, though I'm not sure if it's because I'm in windowed mode or what, but I keep seeing "wires" poking through the back of my Mithra. Seriously.

The controls are rather fluid once you get the hang of them, I'm chalking up my difficulty getting my character to actually RUN and not walk to the fact that I have a crappy PS2 ripoff USB controller.

The combat controls, on the other hand, I've yet to really figure out. There's points where my character is just standing there doing nothing until I hit the cancel button 4 times, then she does some big attack, then I have to bring up the "action bar" UI again and start clicking things. This happens every 3-4 attacks, though I think it's probably an issue with the way the bindings are setup with the controller.


On the subject of death; I'm only level 4 (main level) but I've yet to see a death penalty, aside from failing the leve you're on and porting back to the nearest Aethryte. If there really are no penalties aside from this, thank tits!


The starting quest-line is long and a very, very good way to introduce you to the mechanics and teach you how to use the map and find your way around. The only complaint I have here is sometimes difficult to understand pointers.


All in all I may be slowly coming around. It's currently highly dependent on whether or not I can figure out combat. The in-game tuts are absolutely useless in most regards. Typos, ahoy!


I've had to spend an awful lot of time running around trying to figure out where things are, how things work, and wtf to do. Some may find this entertaining, before tonight I never did, but I'm actually enjoying it, somewhat.

Another drawback I write off to my use of windowed mode is the fact that dialogue and menu screens tend to take an awful long time to load. 5-10 seconds may not seem much, but it adds up when checking 100 NPCs to see what their function is.

[Andromeda]

I'm glad to read some positives in the post as well. ^^ I did find fishing a little boring in FFXI, but most of it was because despite everything I tried I could never level up the craft. Probably would have enjoyed it more if I made progress.

I do have inquire, how much reading about the game had you done prior to going into the beta? I think some of the questions or places you got stuck might have been answered there. Apart from in game help text, it is a beta so I don't think they hand out manuals. *shrugs* I'm hoping I get into the PS3 beta when they get around to it.

I'm figuring a lot of the problems that currently exist in the game will be fixed and smoothed out by the time the PS3 version releases. So I should probably have an easier transition. Sort of why I was a glad I joined FFXI on the PS2 side rather than PC side. Though I think the PC guys got a pretty solid game even since it had been out in Japan for a year or more.

[Sean]

I do have inquire, how much reading about the game had you done prior to going into the beta? I think some of the questions or places you got stuck might have been answered there. Apart from in game help text, it is a beta so I don't think they hand out manuals. *shrugs* I'm hoping I get into the PS3 beta when they get around to it.

I didn't read MUCH. I just knew that everything was broken into classes. You didn't pick a "job" and then later a "subjob" then level tradeskills on those jobs. I knew tradeskills became their own independent classes and that you had class levels and main levels.

Maybe it's not implemented yet, but they haven't put any "layouts" for the gamepad in, either. This isn't so bad, because it's awfully easy to map buttons to functions in their config, but if you've never played XI you might not know what you want each button to do.

I find it interesting Squeenix is doing what Blizzard did with security tokens issuing one time passwords. It's a nigh unhackable way of adding security to your account, and everyone who plays an MMO today knows that China is one **** of a country. It's hard to meet anyone who hasn't been hacked without an authenticator on their account.

Windowed mode is necessary for someone using two monitors. The mouse cursor is NOT blocked while the FFXIV window is active and you can move it through the "wall" into the 2nd monitor then click on a browser window, for instance, but the game will crash with a directx error. Maybe it's actually an error this time, who knows? This could be fixed with a "windowed mode fullscreen" option, like in WoW. I play WoW in windowed mode w/ full screen so I don't see a title bar, and can easily pop to my second monitor without having to minimize the game first.

[che]

I downloaded it today, played some classes. The combat is mildly entertaining (if you can find anything to kill). I had to download a patch some dude put out that enables the hardware mouse because the vanilla in-game mouse is so laggy its barely playable. The worlds looked decent, but everything is static. There's no sense that you're in a living environment, you can't move up or down places with rocks without having to walk all the way around them (which is like FFXI...but this isn't supposed to be the same game, is it??)

Overall, the game feels really clunky and I honestly am so unimpressed with it that I am no longer interested in purchasing it. I can't believe it comes out in less than two weeks.

[Merlin]

I'm taking Andro's approach and holding my judgment until the issues are worked out. MMOs have a bad habit of being rather clunky at first because developers know they can just patch shit later. I find this stupid because you should release a perfected game and then just make it even better... not spend 5 years on something that still has issues on release. WoW is no different. I played it when it first came out and it had major issues as well, especially server related.

Overall I haven't heard anything that would steer me away. A lot of Sean's negatives are what made FFXI different than WoW... things I actually like. Of course since I haven't played the beta I can't say much at this point. My new graphics card hasn't came in yet.

On the other hand, if the windowed mode is anything like the graphics test was... I won't like it. In the test, the game was 1080P + title bar, so it ran off the bottom of the screen and under the task bar. I had to minimize the task bar and I still couldn't see the whole game without squeezing the title bar up to a sliver. It's not exactly rocket science to strip a title bar off something in C, especially since the title bar is an addition rather than a subtraction... you(coder) have to deliberately put it there. I also found it rather stupid that it is in Direct X 9, which is way past outdated at this point.

[Sean]

I'd agree with Chad. The game's engine feels exactly like XIs. There a lot of input lag, and the more I fought things the more bored I got. At least they took the modern MMO approach of multiple buttons to push, unlike in XI where melee classes had shit to do except build TP with auto-attack and unleash TP drains.


Even in full screen the graphics "errors" are there. Bad shading, bad rendering all around, and I'm using a fairly modern card (GTX 260)

Honestly, the more I thought about it and contemplated HARD on whether or not I could see myself spending the amount of time in this game I've spent in WoW, I ultimately came to the conclusion of no. It really just feels like a highly polished update to FFXI. Seeing the exact same races, graphical styles, environment annoyances (running around a SHORT cliff rather than jumping off it), and overall combat mechanics, as well as purposeful slowdowns (slow UIs, slow reaction time from button push to attack being made, slow to switch between 1, 2, 3, or 4 on the action bar using the controller's d-pad) and this isn't from lag, my latency is lower than it is in WoW (sub 200ms)

The negatives far outweigh the positives of this game. If I didn't have an alternative (WoW, in my case) I'd possibly play it, but seeing as I have a fully functioning, fun (to me) MMO already, this doesn't come close to being good enough for me to want to replace WoW with it.


Merlin: I couldn't agree more with your first comment. The fact that Age of Conan released with no post-40 content and only ONE working group instance was what killed it for me, else it would've easily replaced WoW back then.

I can expect to find bugs, and understand them to an extent, but there's a difference between server-related bugs that cause lag or disconnects versus terrible programming making for nightmarish patch downloads/installs.

[Merlin]

I'm starting to get the feeling this will be a niche game... that die-hard fans will buy it, but not much else. Why? Because it will quickly be compared to WoW by the critics, just like its predecessor was when WoW came out. Critics will ride your ass hard for screwing up the basics, like grammar, UI, and leaving out features as simple as jumping/falling. Coming out the door with an average review of say 6/10 will hurt this game badly. Yes, not everyone spends money based off of reviewers(who are often bought out *cough* Blizzard *cough*) but a lot of them do. And really, how many reviewers go back a year later and update MMO reviews after the patches are in? None that I frequent.

[che]

I think you're right about the die-hard fan game. It's so very similar to FFXI that it allows all the previous FFXI people that had quit (and the minority who still play) to relive the experience they all once loved, but with updates. I have no doubt in my mind FFXIV will be better than FFXI (after all, the retail version of FFXI was practically unplayable when it came out).

That being said, of course people are going to compare it to WoW. WoW is/was a groundbreaking MMO that dominated the market and appealed to many types of gamers, not just the hardcore ones, which is the first time an MMO has taken that route in history (arguably). WoW will be compared to for ages to come, even if you can't really compare apples to oranges, they're still both fruit.

My original post in this thread had a lot of negative things to say about the game, but I was being honest about the way I felt after playing the beta. I have no doubt it will get better, I'm just not sure how much. Will it be entertaining to me after playing WoW? Not sure. However, the game has a solid foundation for something greater imo.

I'm also older now and have more responsibilities, so I'm in a much different position than when I was 16 and playing FFXI. I have to ask questions like "can I afford this?" and "do I have the time for this?" as well as being a critic.

[Dan558]

Well I'm glad i didn't rush and pre-order this game or anything because it sounds pretty lackluster. FFXI had the right idea, i feel, but failed completely at implementing it.

I heard that this game was more solo-friendly which was a big plus for me (you couldn't do anything past level 15 or so in XI without being completely dependant on 5 or so other people). Unfortunately it sounds like this game has a lot of control and UI problems that XI suffered from. And if what your saying is true concerning some of the glitches mentioned I'm even more greatful i didn't invest hope in this game.

It is lame that basically the exact same races are used with only name changes and now there are two sects (ie night and day for the "new" mithra) but i was at least happy to hear that they wern't stupid this time and added some customization so everyone of the same race is a clone.

I used to play WoW and quit several months ago because i got bored but have been having mmo itches since. I was kinda hoping that XIV would be a lot better and different than XI so i could maybe pick up a new mmo but sadly it just sounds like an altered XI with better graphics. WoW: Cataclysm looks more interesting so i'll probably just go back to it when it comes out, the game may be simple but it works (mostly...i've gotten used to some of it's flaws)

Maybe if they implement a lot of new, game changing things and it's not expensive to play then i'll try it out in the distant future

[Zargabaath]

It is lame that basically the exact same races are used with only name changes and now there are two sects (ie night and day for the "new" mithra) but i was at least happy to hear that they wern't stupid this time and added some customization so everyone of the same race is a clone.

How is that lame? Most MMOs use Tolkien races in their games: Elves, Orcs, Dwarves, etc. Final Fantasy XI was different in that it used some unique races and SE decided to carry them over, as is a MMO norm, to Final Fantasy XIV with some changes. Granted, a fan, of SE would think that they would create original races, excluding humans, for Final Fantasy XIV. Is it lame that a lot of MMOs use the same races as mostly everybody else? Or is SE the only company that is lame for re-using their "MMO races" again in Final Fantasy XIV?

Though I would have liked a female Roegadyn and male Miqo'te in FFXIV, which could be introduced later in the games life.

[che]

Didn't wanna put this in a new thread, but here is a really nice video on the character growth, exp fatique, etc:



And some changes they're making for release:

• [li]Notorious Monsters
  Soon, there will be NM's even in the world of FFXIV. These will look very different from most of the other normal monsters. We're planning to introduce NM's that are so huge they make a Malboro look small. The tranquil era is about to end! We're going to torment adventurers with these powered up, aesthetically varied NM's which we've prepared "episodes" for. [/li]
  [li]Damaging monster body parts:
  There are monsters which have different body parts that can be damaged. Using a specific weapon skill while standing in a specified position can lead to cutting a monster's body part off. For example, you can cut Malboro's vines or a horn/tail if the enemy has one. In addition to changing the monster's appearance, those actions can have the following effects:
  - Weakening the monster
  - Preventing monsters from using specific skills
  - Acquiring materials from cut/damaged body parts[/li]
  [li]Other: By combining a particular race's equipment etc with city-state it's unavoidable that a certain degree of being tied down will occur, so this time we are not thinking of doing that. [I'm a little unclear here but I think this means they want to avoid certain races being tied to certain city-states]
  Scenario's are balanced, basically, completely soloable or depending on the situation doable with a small number of people. "For the most part, soloable" [/li]
  [li]City-states' Guilds: Not all guilds are in every city-state
  By passing a certain condition, "class quests" will become available at guilds. Class quests are of course related directly to the class itself, but at the same time are a way to truly learn the details of each city-state. Please enjoy the story revealed in these quests, in addition to the quest rewards themselves.
  When you complete a quest, you will receive Guild Tokens [marks?]. We are planning to add more and more things to exchange tokens for.[/li]
  [li]Balances to enmity in party battle: In beta, they made adjustments to enmity based on magic and abilities, but they have plans for more. These changes, however, will probably take a while to implement. They plan on adjusting the enmity according to contents, equipment, abilities, monsters, and so on. These changes will be made continuously after service begins based on how things are going.[/li]
  [li]Mana Regeneration: In FFXIV, management of your MP use is supposed to be an important part of strategy. They’d also like magic to have explosive power in fewer hits, and not just be used to spam enemies with light damage attacks. To promote this, they’d like to continue to balance the recovery methods used for MP, including the abilities and aetherite, as well as adding new methods later on.[/li]
  [li]Usefulness of Battle Regimen
  Battle regimen serve a double purpose: to expand the strategy of party play, and to reduce the difficulty/rigidness in forming parties. They are not just for doing extra damage, there are lots of various effects. For example:
  [/li][li]- Phys Resistance Debuff[/li]
  [li]Normal melee attack -> Normal melee attack (ex. slash -> punch [these are basic DoW abilities])[/li]
  [li]- Magic Resistance Debuff[/li]
  [li]Normal melee attack -> Normal magical attack (ex. slash -> spirit dart)[/li]
  [li]- Cast speed down + MP consumption up[/li]
  [li]Normal melee attack -> Magic (ex. slash -> Fire)[/li]
  [li]- TP gain reduction + TP consumption up[/li]
  [li]Normal melee attack -> Weapon skill (ex. Slash -> Red Lotus)[/li]
  [li]- Action aptitude up (Using a different class ability on the current class grants the same effect as when used on the other class)[/li]
  [li]Same class magic -> Magic[/li]
  [li]Same class Weapon skill -> Weapon skill (ex. Trunksplitter -> Brandish)[/li]
  [li]- Damage up[/li]
  [li]Various class WS -> WS -> Magic[/li]
  [li]Various class magic -> Magic -> WS (ex. Blizzard -> Scourge -> Puncture)[/li]
  [li]For example, if it's difficult to continue dealing physical damage, use Phys resistance debuff. If it's a casting monster, use cast time debuff + MP consumption increase etc.[/li]
  [li]Negotiations are another way of obtaining loot (other than battles). By choosing the right conversation subject with a NPC, player can engage in negotiations and receive items in exchange for items wanted by the NPC. If player does exceptionally well, it's possible to get some free stuff as an extra.[/li]
  [li]Ishgard: Ishgard's people have long been at war with man-eating dragons, and thus have not taken on Adventurers. In this city, there are already several quests appearing for the "Dragon Slayers" [faction?] who are at war with the dragons. [/li]
  [li]Guildleves in the Beta: We sincerely apologize to our open beta testers for the client errors that would occur more frequently during guildleves in the beta. In the release version, we are dealing with these diligently.[/li]
  [li]Retainer: Right now, when you buy something from a retainer, there is an unnecessarily long delay. On release, we plan to make this a lot more smooth. We would like to make improvements to make commerce even easier for everyone.[/li]
  [li]Relationship Crafting/Gathering & PC Status: PC's physical level & attributes will have an effect on crafting and gathering. There are hints in the game as to what does what, so please search for it.
  Crafting[/li]
  [li]Physical: Closely related to the tool being used and will particularly affect quality[/li]
  [li]Attributes: related to "Godsend" [I think these are the extra result/HQ result] probability & "attribute stability" [?][/li]
  [li]Gathering[/li]
  [li]Physical: Affects difficulty in obtaining items in the "gather" phase as well as the number of items obtained
  [translator note].. this is a literal translation of "physical" and "attribute" I wasn't sure here if they're talking about skill level or what, but judging from the use of katakana for Physical, I must assume it means physical level, even though that sounds odd to have an effect here.[/li]
  [li]Market: We don't want crafters and gatherers to simply "put up" their items on the market and that's it. We want them to also act as salesmen and learn to play the market intelligently. For this purpose, we will begin with focus on the Bazaar market system. On that note, in order to be able to tell "What's for sale?" etc, we are planning to adjust policy and add functionality to improve the user friendliness. [/li]
  [li]Retrying guildleves: The best way to level is with guildleves, that is, even without the guardian's favor, you will earn way more exp and skill points per each kill. For this reason, we wanted to prevent abusive use of leves by killing all the monsters but failing right at the end and then retrying on the spot. However, if you visit the NPC that gave you the leve, you can retry it.[/li]
  [li]There will be hardware mouse support![/li]
  [li]We believe that the item selection interface should be very responsive, and by release we will have introduced a MUCH improved version. After release we will continue improving this.[/li]
  [li]The FFXIV development team acknowledged that there's issues with the mouse and user interface and apologized about it. Hardware Mouse + UI improvements will be a major focus for them.[/li]
  [li]There will be package discount pricing on the subscription (Japan-3months, NA/EU 3/6 months)[/li]
  [li]Due to game balance consideration, the level cap on release will be 50[/li]
  [li]We will change it so you do not lose disabled abilities when changing class any more. [assume this means they won't leave the ability bar, they will probably just gray][/li]
  [li]Physical stat distribution will affect both crafting and gathering classes as much as it does everyone else.[/li]
  [li]There aren't any "open world" NMs outside of guildleves.[/li]
  [li]New hairstyles will be added, as well as the ability to change hairstyle in game after you make your character.[/li]
  [li]Crafters will be able to cooperate in large-scale projects (boats, cannons, wedding cakes! YUM) so more fun for you and your company![/li]
  [li]There will be guildleves where crafters and adventurers have to cooperate.[/li]
  [li]The guildleve issue will be fixed so they cooldown will be significantly decreased from 48 hours.[/li]
  [li]Anima regeneration will have to be raised since you'll have to travel more for more frequent guildleves.[/li]
  [li]The faction leves have you fight different beastman tribes and such.[/li]

Yes, I copy/pasted that. No, I'm not going to go back and remove all the wrong tags so it looks pretty. Sorry^^.

[Selcopa]

Fatigue is a nice system. WoW had that a little bit, just in the other direction, instead of slowing down other players, they just give 100% exp bonus to people who have 'rested' for a while. I like this idea better.

I also like the fact that you don't need multiple characters to have different jobs, I always liked that about FFXI, a decked out account doesn't have to have 6 different characters leveled, and your previous accomplishments(phys level and gear) can carry over.

All in all, i'll probably wait a bit for the game to be released and fixed a little before playing, i'm an end game player, and it takes time for them to get end game going. Although I would be interested in sitting in town crafting while I play poker. hmm ideas ideas.

[Dan558]

I also like the fact that you don't need multiple characters to have different jobs, I always liked that about FFXI, a decked out account doesn't have to have 6 different characters leveled, and your previous accomplishments(phys level and gear) can carry over.

Yea except you need about 6 times the inventory space and FFXI had a terrible inventory method (stacks of 12, small storage that was difficult/expensive to upgrade etc.) it makes a horrible system for pack rats or people who think for the future. Yea you didn't have to level 6 completely different characters (although in that way you can experience a different race, town etc.) but FFXI was certainly long and tedious in its own way.

I hope FFXIV does a better job on a lot of things over FFXI

[Merlin]

From what I've read, when your physical level goes up you get points to distribute to the different core attributes like strength, dexterity, etc... I like being able to select my own stats and all, but this also limits the so-called "infinite possibilities" that you can be with your character. Reason is, if you max out your strength and dexterity and have nothing left for magic, you'd make a pretty shitty mage end-game. Your party asks you to switch to another job but you can't, not because you don't have that job, but because your stats would suck so bad you'd be useless. That was one good thing about job-switching in FF XI... when you switch jobs, your stats adjusted with it.

So yeah, I think my first character will be a trial run to just see how everything goes. I mean I seriously doubt you could eventually max all your stats. That would defeat the whole purpose of choosing them. I don't want to end up with an end-game character that is gimped to hell because of choices I made a year or two before. /sigh.